Ask Engadget HD: How can I record premium content on my HTPC?

I'm a big DIY PC guy, and I've been looking into ways of recording HDTV on my PC for quite sometime now. The problem is, I want to record HD Streams from my local Cable Provider (Charter), or possibly switch to Dish Network's HD-only package and record those streams. Unfortunately, either of those requires either a CableCARD or proprietary tuner. I know DirecTV has one in the works (Release Date: Day and Date with Duke Nukem Forever, I hear), and that Niveus has a dual CableCARD USB 2.0 Tuner (At an ungodly $1500 price tag), but that's all I can find!
Believe us, we hear ya' Justin, but the options are slim. But while none are perfect there are a few ways to accomplish what your after.
The easiest and cheapest way to record just about everything your cable co' provides is to buy a new HTPC from a OEM like Dell or HP. Yeah, we know it sucks, but that's the way CableLabs wants it, and that's the way they get it. We don't see CableLabs eliminating this OEM only policy anytime soon either, so unless someone discovers a work around, even if you could find a stand-alone CableCARD USB tuner ($180) it wouldn't work on a DIY rig. Luckily there are a lot of OEM manufactures who've signed up with CableLabs and offer HTPCs with CableCARD tuners, but the cheapest one we know of is the Dell XPS 420 -- which can be had for just under $1100. This is a pretty good deal considering what you get, and the only thing we can say against it is that we'd rather have a case that feels at home in our HT rack.

There are two others options that may work in your area though. The first is to get an HDHomeRun. Using the latest Vista drivers, the HDHomeRun enables Vista Media Center (and others) to access clear QAM programming from your cable provider. The problem is that while all cable channels are carried via QAM, in most areas none of the channels are sent in the clear. At the very minimum you'll have access to CBS, NBC, FOX, and PBS; but most can already get these channels with an antenna. There are some very lucky people who's cable co' doesn't lock down all the channels, but unfortunately this isn't the norm. The second option available today is just as hit or miss. With the right drivers and STB from your cable co' you can record via 1394, but the problem is the same as with clear QAM. The only channels that are not protected with 5C encryption are usually the same ones sent in the clear. The other problem is that the drivers are by no means official (read not supported) and getting a cable box with a functional 1394 port will cost ya a monthly fee -- assuming you can even get one.
Looking forward, we're not sure if we'll ever see a non-OEM CableCARD tuner, but there are a few promising options around the corner. Due this quarter is the Hauppauge component capture card that will record HD from a cable box via component -- but you'll need to find a way to change the channels. IR will be the most straight forward solution, but there are other options if your STB has a functional 1394 port or RS-232. But what will probably be the best option is the DirecTV dual USB tuner -- expected to cost less than $200 and hoped for this year -- provided you can get a signal, this may be the best bet, eventually.
Got a burning question that you'd love to toss out for Engadget HD (or its readers) to take a look at? Tired of Google's blank stares when you ask for real-world experiences? Hit us up at ask at engadgethd dawt com and keep an eye on this space -- your inquiry could be next.

There are two others options that may work in your area though. The first is to get an HDHomeRun. Using the latest Vista drivers, the HDHomeRun enables Vista Media Center (and others) to access clear QAM programming from your cable provider. The problem is that while all cable channels are carried via QAM, in most areas none of the channels are sent in the clear. At the very minimum you'll have access to CBS, NBC, FOX, and PBS; but most can already get these channels with an antenna. There are some very lucky people who's cable co' doesn't lock down all the channels, but unfortunately this isn't the norm. The second option available today is just as hit or miss. With the right drivers and STB from your cable co' you can record via 1394, but the problem is the same as with clear QAM. The only channels that are not protected with 5C encryption are usually the same ones sent in the clear. The other problem is that the drivers are by no means official (read not supported) and getting a cable box with a functional 1394 port will cost ya a monthly fee -- assuming you can even get one.
Looking forward, we're not sure if we'll ever see a non-OEM CableCARD tuner, but there are a few promising options around the corner. Due this quarter is the Hauppauge component capture card that will record HD from a cable box via component -- but you'll need to find a way to change the channels. IR will be the most straight forward solution, but there are other options if your STB has a functional 1394 port or RS-232. But what will probably be the best option is the DirecTV dual USB tuner -- expected to cost less than $200 and hoped for this year -- provided you can get a signal, this may be the best bet, eventually.
Got a burning question that you'd love to toss out for Engadget HD (or its readers) to take a look at? Tired of Google's blank stares when you ask for real-world experiences? Hit us up at ask at engadgethd dawt com and keep an eye on this space -- your inquiry could be next.























Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
jstach500 @ Mar 12th 2008 12:31PM
Don't forget the Tivo HD and Series 3 options. You can transfer programs to your PC, but you will need to use some backend processing to free them from their .tivo shackles.
Jon @ Mar 12th 2008 12:31PM
i own the Ati Tv wonder w/ Cablecard with my XPS420 .. the Picture looks great i use it as a "backup" tuner for my crapcast dvr incase it freezes during Lost etc ... and a 3rd tuner as well .. Works well with Vista and XB360 media extender , i was thinking about adding the Hdhomerun but im trying to find out if it can be used in vista along with the ati tvwonder i have read conflicting reports
Stumpy25 @ Mar 12th 2008 5:50PM
FYI, I'm running 3 cablecard tuners and 1-dual-tuner-HDHomerun with great results. It can work, it was a problem for a while, but now it's all good. The only hack I had to do was the one that allows for 3 cablecard tuners. I use my HdHomerun for OTA HD only, so it doesn't conflict with my cablecards. OTA HD quality is much better than HD over cable in my area.
beertroll @ Mar 12th 2008 12:42PM
I am excited about the DirecTV HDCP-20! This is the only solution that will give all of the content I want in HD with no compromises.
Dan @ Mar 12th 2008 12:51PM
I do have the Vista CABLECARD tuner in my HP computer. It works very well after some initial setup problems. The nice thing about recording onto a PC is that you can records LOTS of HD. I have 2 1TB hard drives and can record premium channels onto them. The downside is that, aside from using a media center extender, there is no way to transfer any of these programs onto DVD or any other format. Or is there?
h0mi @ Mar 12th 2008 12:57PM
When using a cablecard there's also the issue of the copy protection flag. YMWV because different cable franchises are doing different things. Cox in OC is protecting little or nothing; in phoenix and san diego, Cox protects everything but broadcast. If you own a tivo HD (as I do) it means you can record the shows but can't back up copies to your PC via tivo desktop without hacking the tivo HD.
Erwos @ Mar 12th 2008 1:38PM
If they're protecting content that they shouldn't be protecting, you need to complain to the FCC. They are _not_ allowed to do that according to FCC regulations.
nathan @ Mar 12th 2008 12:58PM
Here you go: Record all of the content including premium HD content from DISH or DirectTV to your PC. It's not cheap but by all reports it really works:
http://www.nextcomwireless.com/R5000/home.htm
Best of all, unlike the cable card solution, etc etc, the programs are not locked down or encrypted, so you can take them with you on an airplane and watch on your PC, or archive stuff to disc, etc.
Or, for a cheap solution, with DISH, there is the PVRExplorer solution. It's less flexible (no mpg4 recording) and, in fact, it's FREE -- but much less reliable and easy to use. You get what you pay for?
Casey Vincent @ Mar 12th 2008 12:58PM
I have been using the HD Home Run for awhile now and am very happy getting my HD locals (in Colorado they have yet to build the tower that will put us at full power). Unfortunatly I get no other HD.
I really can't wait for the DirecTV reciever as I really want to cast off Comcast and their rediculous rates. Hopefully the tuner comes out this year!
David @ Mar 12th 2008 12:58PM
What about a Black Magic Intensity Pro? It's got HD Component input. Get an IR blaster and a basic capture program, and you'd be off and running for $349.
Erwos @ Mar 12th 2008 1:33PM
That BlackMagic card captures in uncompressed form, and there are no working drivers for any media center package I'm aware of. Trust me, if the solution was that easy, everyone would know about it. (This is probably a good thing to keep in mind for life in general.)
Also, there's no real confirmation if the DirecTV tuner will or will not require an OEM-built PC. I wouldn't get my hopes up too far until we see more details.
Robert Crockett @ Mar 12th 2008 1:30PM
Is it really true that it is not likely that we will EVER see a TV tuner for the PC that has a cable card and can do HD? I actually believe we will see them...some day.
Jon @ Mar 12th 2008 1:38PM
The ATI tv wonder does cablecard in HD , without the cable card it does QAM with it it does everything HD
Robert Crockett @ Mar 12th 2008 1:45PM
Except you cannot buy that product without buying a $1000 PC.
Alan @ Mar 12th 2008 1:39PM
Here are a couple of guides that may help
What to expect when recording various TV sources.
http://www.missingremote.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2374&Itemid=232
CableCard Resources
http://www.missingremote.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2497&Itemid=241
PC TV Tuner Guide
http://www.missingremote.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2034&Itemid=232
plozen @ Mar 12th 2008 1:42PM
Slightly off-topic, but I'm using OTA to record/view HD to a Windows XP MCE 2005. I'm using a Hauppauge ATSC/NTSC card. I get great signal strength, but my HD picture is jumpy, like you'd see on a streaming broadcast that can't keep up almost.
2.8 GHZ P4
1.5 GB RAM
512MB Geforce 7600
Anyone with suggestions? More RAM? Computer to slow?
Thanks
andy @ Mar 12th 2008 1:47PM
I'd be looking at your CPU (it has to be encoded), your RAM clock (you have to buffer) and the HDD interface speed (don't expect smooth if you're not storing a lot faster than you're capturing and encoding).
I love my TIVO s3 combined with OTA broadcast. It works great :D
lindoro @ Mar 12th 2008 2:26PM
HD does *not* need to be encoded. HD is digital and is encoded at the broadcaster. HD recording is just a matter of tuning the stream and dumping it to disk, and therefore requires next to no CPU. That said, most P4s are going to be scraping by in playback, especially in a dog like Windows. Improve your CPU, everything else is fine.
Daza @ May 9th 2008 8:22AM
You may want to use the NVIDIA Pure Video decoder which will hopefully decode MPEG-2 a lot better than the current codec you are using by placing more of the load on the video card rather than the CPU.
MI @ Mar 12th 2008 1:50PM
I saw a good article on what the FCC should be doing is making Comcast and Verizon (and all the other cable type companies) broadcast all the channels that used to be analog (IE. everything but HBO and the like) in CLEAR QAM! They are supposed to work for us right? I think that would solve all the problems. Barring that, my five tuner sagetv system goes dark next Feb... Bummer
Ben @ Mar 12th 2008 1:51PM
You mean this one?
www.engadgethd.com/2007/12/14/hey-fcc-force-big-cable-to-clear-our-qam/
Robert Crockett @ Mar 12th 2008 2:00PM
Would that do anything for HD programming though? I could care less if I get the programs digitally or via analog.
MI @ Mar 12th 2008 10:03PM
Hmmm, my first reply disappeared... Anyway;
Yep that's the one. I think if they'd just clear the signal we're paying for, we'd be good to go.
It would do everything for HD as the HDTV signal that is coming off FIOS at least is a secured QAM signal (not sure if 'secure' is the right term) for everything but the local ABC, NBC etc. So the only way to see Discover, for example, is to use their tuner. My HDTV has a QAM tuner in it, that only gets a few of the channels that they offer, my SageTV has a QAM tuner in it so it only gets the local channels, so I must use their tuner and their DVR (or TIVO with a cable card) Still, I'm down to 1 or two tuners, where my SageTV can support as many tuners as I can put in it, and I don't have to degrade myself to Windows Vista to accomplish it, and can build my own system.
Lastly, HDTV is inherently digital, so digital is the only way to get it, No?
cclaunch @ Mar 12th 2008 2:13PM
You can try the firewire drivers for windows media center based comps. Works great.
http://home.comcast.net/~exdeus/stbfirewire/
RCoy @ Mar 12th 2008 3:37PM
Why is it that on various BitTorrent sites you see a bunch of Hi-Def captures from Premium content providers like HBO-HD, Showtime-HD etc? How are they able to capture this stuff if there are broadcast flags involved?
Ben @ Mar 12th 2008 2:34PM
First off, there is no "broadcast flag."
And just about any TiVo HD owner can record HBO HD and copy shows off to the PC to encode and post online.
JarkHD @ Mar 12th 2008 4:54PM
There is a new device from Hauppauge coming out that will allow component video to be recorded to a pc through the usb port. See my writeup about it here, http://jarkhd.blogspot.com/2008/03/hauppauge-hd-pvr-mythtv-and-analog-hole.html
RCoy @ Mar 12th 2008 5:53PM
Ben,
I think you are incorrect..For the sake of this article please elaborate, on your reply. It was my understanding that the "Broadcast Flag" comes and goes and it is really hit or miss on what can be recorded and pulled off the TiVoHD...But most premium content is indeed flagged and protected...
According to this artice:
http://www.tivoblog.com/archives/2008/02/17/tivotogo-copy-protection/
I can't even transfer a Martha Stewart show due to the braodcast flag! Not that I would want to, but how would HBO or premium content be any different?
Discuss!
Ben @ Mar 12th 2008 5:56PM
RCoy,
The "Broadcast Flat" was an FCC mandate that would allow broadcasters to flag content in an attempt to control recording of broadcasted content. On your HD TiVo, you can record broadcast TV (read OTA) and transfer anything you want to your PC.
You are talking about cable TV, and thus has nothing to do with the "broadcast flag" that was revoked.
The problem you have is with your cable co' not the TiVo or in many cases the content holders. You need to file a complaint with the FCC as there are rules that usually allow you to transfers most shows, like Martha Stuart. Now HBO, etc is another story.
johnny-c @ Mar 12th 2008 7:08PM
I have CommieCast and it seems that there isn't much that is 5C encrypted over firewire. However, there isn't much in the way of software that supports HDTV over firewire. There are some workarounds, but nothing very elegant. The best I've seen is Tim Moore's FireSTB for Windows Media Center. However, development ceased in 2006, and it doesn't seem to work well with Vista. If there are any developers out there that would want to help redevelop this app, head over to http://thegreenbutton.com/forums/thread/249764.aspx.
Brian Yorks @ Mar 13th 2008 1:55AM
End of 2009 is when the DirecTV hookup to your Windows box will be coming out. A friend of mine was talking to me about it last week who works in that area.
johnny-c @ Mar 13th 2008 11:35AM
Do you mean end of 2008? If you mean end of 2009, what's the delay? I thought it was supposed to be out this May.
ljasper79 @ Mar 13th 2008 9:16PM
WHY IS NO ONE MAKING A COMPONENT VIDEO CAPTURE CARD??? SCREW DVI OR HDMI!!! NO ONE CAN COPY PROTECT MY COMPONENT OUTPUTS ALL I WANT IS SOMEONE TO MAKE AN ANALOG COMPONENT CAPTURE CARD!!!
johnny-c @ Mar 13th 2008 9:58PM
http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/01/11/hauppauge-intros-usb-pvr-with-component-input/
TechGuru @ Apr 11th 2008 1:55PM
My card has component inputs as well. Never needed to use them though.
TechGuru @ Apr 11th 2008 6:57PM
http://powermax.com/parts/show/a-drb-0500-ipcc
TechGuru @ Apr 12th 2008 3:36AM
Well it does,
See manufactures site:
http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/intensity/techspecs/
TechGuru @ Mar 15th 2008 5:48PM
I am currently able to record DirecTV HD from my H20 DirecTV HD receiver to my computer via this PCIe card.
http://powermax.com/parts/show/a-drb-0500-ipcc
See samples here: http://txnj.net/directvhd/
TechGuru @ Mar 15th 2008 5:51PM
Forgot to mention, that I'm doing it via HDMI not component and no DirecTV channels I've come across have HDCP on them. But I have not ordered a HD PPV movie as of yet so I don't know about HDCP on them.
ljasper79 @ Apr 12th 2008 2:13AM
I see no mention of component inputs on this card. Only on the $500+ ones :(
TechGuru @ Apr 11th 2008 1:52PM
ljasper79, my card also has Component inputs, but since DirecTV is not using HDCP I have no need to use them.
ljasper79 @ Apr 11th 2008 3:47PM
and what card might that be?
S4Rs @ May 1st 2008 10:57AM
I dont get why things like HDMI encryption haven't been hacked yet. this is the ultimate geek hack. All the good hackers must be spending their time unlocking iphones or something...
Why cant someone cut open an HDMI, record a bitstream onto a pc, and then convert it to the MP4 or whatever it is. this is 0's and 1s!!
I am not that smart though.
Brett @ May 25th 2008 9:19PM
Um.. I see on sony's website, that they're selling the ATI device. Most of you are saying that you cannot use it though... I didn't personally order it, but I was just wondering if you can purchase this, without a Sony computer, like you're saying...
Link:
http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&langId=-1&productId=8198552921665246461&storeId=10151