Best Buy's not shy about Blu-ray's victory

by Darren Murph, posted Feb 21st 2008 at 12:26AM

It's obviously not a secret that Blu-ray came out on top of the world's most recent physical media scuffle, but Best Buy's Canadian branch is most certainly not being subtle about announcing said fact. The main splash screen currently on the site grabs your attention with "Format War Over: Blu-ray Wins! We've got your Blu-ray needs covered." Sheesh -- tell the world how you really feel, why don'tcha?

Filed under: Industry, Blu-ray

Tags: best buy, BestBuy, blu-ray, comedy, format war, FormatWar, funny, retail, support

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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)

Highly Ranked

Prey521 @ Feb 21st 2008 12:41AM

LOL could they be any more obvious? LMAO

Highly Ranked

andyj @ Feb 21st 2008 12:46AM

That's gotta burn all of the HD DVD chaps good, awesome!

Neutral

Boostjunkie @ Feb 21st 2008 8:28AM

Hmm? Isn't everyone glad this is over? What burns is that they start at $399. HD-DVD started at $149. It's a shame that the price is so high. The war with HD-DVD over, but lets see consumers adopt the format at these prices.

Highest Ranked

John B @ Feb 21st 2008 8:31AM

Yes, that's it. Show the world why so many HD DVD supporters dislike the arrogance of many BD fanboys! I suppose that dancing around an HD DVD player taking turns whacking it with a sledgehammer chanting "Blu-ray! Blu-Ray!" is on your agenda for tonight?

How pathetic that so many people like you, TT, nFinity, H4ldol, etc. have taken so seriously the encoding method of a f**king 12cm piece of plastic. Get over it.

Highly Ranked

Charles @ Feb 21st 2008 9:39PM

What's worse is that they have no idea what they're talking about when they spew out random jabs like "higher bit rates on Blu-ray." They automatically assume more is better/superior. A skilled compressionist can do an excellent job with the medium average bit rates offered on HD DVD. As codecs improve (likely 50% over the course of its use), bit rates will become wholly irrelevant as they did on DVD. The MPEG-2 encoders now are so efficient that it's remarkable how good DVD picture quality can get on modern releases.

Neutral

MI @ Feb 21st 2008 12:49AM

"tell the world how you really feel, why don'tcha?"

I think they feel like they want people to spend some money!

Highly Ranked

dynamius @ Feb 21st 2008 12:55AM

oh great, now there's very little incentive for them to lower prices anymore. starting at $399... yeah right. so now that the war is over, it's time to milk the consumers... yeah, no thanks. this is gonna take a while...

Highly Ranked

DrXym @ Feb 21st 2008 4:29AM

I reckon these moronic arguments are made by disgruntled HD DVD owners or people too young to remember how much DVD players cost.

There are a dozen or so blu ray manufacturers and hundreds of retailers competing for the money in your wallet. And there are more manufacturers and player models entering the market all the time. So explain please why prices won't fall? Did DVD player prices fall or rise because there was a single disk format?

The only reason Toshiba made its players seem "cheap" was because they were taking a massive financial hit on each one to win a format war. Comprende?

Highest Ranked

Sam Winter @ Feb 21st 2008 4:45AM

To compare pricing to DVD's release, I looked at a few big box stores on archive.com that had ecommerce websites or at least listed their products and pricing back in late 90's. DVD players started shipping in March 1997. Almost two years later in november/december during the christmas shopping season of 1998, DVD players started retailed at $249 - $799 depending on model. I used Christmas 1998 as a pricing target because it allows a release timeframe of rougly 20 months, which is the same span of time from the release of Blu-ray players in June of 2006 to now, February 2008.

After collecting the DVD pricing, I used a website that would convert those 1998 dollars into 2008 dollars adjusted for inflation and came out with:
$249 in 1998 = $320.55 in 2007

note: You probably noticed that DVD's 20-month release range ends during the Holiday season, and are thinking that prices would have been lower than normal. To make the comparison a fair one, I looked up prices right before the holiday season, and they appeared to be roughly the same.

I then checked Amazon.com to see current pricing on cheaper Blu-ray players:
Sharp Aquos BDHP20U = $348.00
Samsung BD-P1400 = $356
Sony BDP-S300 = $376
Sony PlayStation 3 = $399.95

Overall, I am surprised that Blu-ray pricing seems to be tracking quite well with DVD's release. I didn't know what to expect, I just
assumed that since the introduction of the HD formats has been so much different from new format releases in the past that the retail pricing over time data might be wildly different. Although the prices are not as drastically low as HD-DVD, it's helpful to remember that HD-DVD players were being heavily subsidized by Toshiba as part of their efforts to win the format war, and that 3rd party consumer elecronics manufacturers are unable to match those retail price points in the near term. That said, Blu-ray hardware does use more expensive system components, although in my opinion the resulting increases in technical specifications more than make up for the difference.

I believe the format war had two primary effects on pricing. Number one, it drove down prices due to competition between the two formats. But, conversely, it also limited consumer adoption even among early adopters. Therefore, it had an effect of maintaining higher prices because of the lack of economies of scale that could have been seen with a one-format marketplace. I believe that now that the format war is finally over, the expected increase in consumer adoption of Blu-ray will act as a catalyst for major competition between the plethora of manufacturers that have already jumped in to the game. I would speculate that by the holiday season this year (08), we will see Blu-ray profile 2.0 players at Walmart for $220-$250.

Neutral

Ryan @ Feb 21st 2008 12:21PM

Seriously though, Blu-ray vs. DVD is a pretty poor analogy to DVD vs. VHS for several reasons.

The first of these is that Blu-ray has more of an uphill battle. The technology of DVD was a big step up over VHS no matter what kind of TV you owned. Chapters, no more rewinding, menus, extra features on the disc, etc. Blu-ray is essentially just a bigger DVD, and its only real advantage can only be realized by a) the less than 50% of people that have an HDTV, and b) people that actually care about picture and audio quality. Blu-ray has a much smaller target audience than DVD did right now, so they need to sell this stuff to just about everyone that can use the technology, whereas DVD could get away with only selling to a quarter of their target audience for a while.

Secondly, Sony has said that they did not intend to "repeat the mistakes of DVD in dropping player prices too fast". The fact that Blu-ray player prices are relatively on par with where DVD player prices were at this point is TERRIBLE, because Blu-ray slashed prices due to the format war. Blu-ray had TONS of EXTRA incentive to slash prices, and they still are barely keeping up with where DVD (who had far less competition) was. Imagine if HD DVD never existed, we'd probably still be looking at a $800 entry cost for Blu-ray.

It took an extra level of competition that DVD never had to deal with just to keep Blu-ray prices close to on par with where DVD prices were at the same time. With that extra level of competition now gone, why in the hell do people expect Blu-ray prices to keep dropping at the same rate they did before (which even then was slightly slower than the competitionless DVD)? Already since the Warner announcement we've seen price cuts and bargain priced software come to a complete halt.

People keep saying Blu-ray players will drop in price *WHEN* they are mass produced. But the true statement should be that they will drop in price *IF* they are mass produced. Warner chose a side because they felt the window of HDM adoption was running thin. Blu-ray needs to realize the same and entice people to jump on board before its too late, rather than just assuming that everyone will jump on board eventually like they did for DVD. Because as much as I love HD content and would pay almost any amount for it, to the average consumer Blu-ray has a lot less going for it now than DVD did when it came around.

Neutral

Sean @ Feb 21st 2008 1:27AM

Do you still get the 5 BD movies for free or is there no reason anymore for that?

Neutral

JoN @ Feb 21st 2008 1:58AM

that offer expired in January as it was scheduled to...

Neutral

morpheus73 @ Feb 21st 2008 1:34AM

Blu isn't truly gonna move any significant hardware until the holidays. They better get the price on the standalones down to $300 at minimum if they want the format to start gaining some serious traction. For those who say "well HD-DVD had players down to $100", you have to remember those players were subsidized by Toshiba; the BDA companies actually would like to make a profit before the prices really drop and the margins become much smaller.

Low Ranked

Steve Jr. @ Feb 21st 2008 1:40AM

Starting at $399... OH GEE thanks that's such a bargain.
GFY... GFY... GFY !!! Thank you.

Neutral

JoN @ Feb 21st 2008 1:58AM

the incentive to lower prices will now come from both competing manufacturers looking to gain market share within the blu-ray player sales, increased savings in cost of tech, and of course, competing to replace dvd.

Highest Ranked

Sy @ Feb 21st 2008 2:20AM

Paramount officially turns Blu:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080221/media_nm/bluray_dc_1

Neutral

andyj @ Feb 21st 2008 3:05AM

Awesome news!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Low Ranked

shawnmos @ Feb 21st 2008 2:35AM

Only $399.99! What a DEAL!

Lowest Ranked

HDpurist @ Feb 21st 2008 2:40AM

399 is a great deal, when there's no competition!

D'OH

Highest Ranked

Sam Winter @ Feb 21st 2008 3:24AM

$399 is actually a good deal considering Blu-ray manufacturers actually WANT TO MAKE MONEY on the hardware they sell. HD-DVD was only dirt cheap because Toshiba was subsidizing the players and losing a TON of money in the process. In addition, Blu does have higher quality custom made system components. But just wait, as the many manufacturers start battling it out for market share as growth continues, prices will drop. This holiday season will be the start of the Blu domination!

Highest Ranked

DrXym @ Feb 21st 2008 4:38AM

Its strange we keep hearing these stupid arguments about Blu Ray means no competition. I wonder why people aren't whining that DVD / CD players or GSM phones mean no competition while they're at it. I'll tell you why because it would be shown as the stupid argument it is.

Samsung, Sony, Philips, Panasonic, Hitachi, LG, JVC, Denon, Pioneer, Sharp, Daewoo and a handful of no-names are all competing with each other for your blu ray bucks. And Best Buy, Circuit City, Walmart, Costco, Amazon, + dozens of other retailers are too.

There is plenty of competition and prices will drop over time.

Neutral

misterhearn @ Feb 21st 2008 3:07AM

YAY ONLY 399.99 for a player that does less than the now defunct HD DVD player YaY! *starts tap dancing* I'm so glad the consumers are winning this war and not the super corporations involved! Lets all ask for more DRM and more region locking if we're all lucky they'll lock it by the city you purchased the media in so that way it only works in your local zip code.

This is the best news yet! Now we'll only see movies with less interactivity and limited advances. I for one cant wait to finally see picture in picture action on my blu ray version of The Matrix collection, its never been done before!!! I can use my old HD DVD player to upscale my old dvds, but the "future is blu" blu indeed! Look out Samsung BR Players HERE I COME!!!!

Neutral

Jove @ Feb 21st 2008 3:17AM

like people have ever been one to decide* dont u know about the street car scandal of san francisco. (i think it was san francisco) did u choose where the pedal of ur car was gonna end up on? did you choose between sacd or dvd+? or how about gas prices? or hybrid technology that is decades old? either people will buy or they wont. period. either that or buy the apple tv or download from other places.

Neutral

Isaac @ Feb 21st 2008 3:38AM

I agree with you. I'm a masochist and love being treated like trash. If we're lucky all Bluray players in the future with eth0 will require online verification like Windows Vista to operate. I think they should require keys for their media also. A masochist can hope can't he?

Highly Ranked

DrXym @ Feb 21st 2008 6:09AM

A PS3 costing $399 does a whole lot more than an HD DVD player. For example you can play AVC & DiVX movies from its HDD, rip CDs, store photos, browse the web, stream from a PC and even play games.

Of course I can understand that you would prefer to focus on some esoteric features of HD DVD and say "ahah! It can't access the internet from movie content!". So what? Perhaps you'll tell me a single HD DVD that justifies hooking the player up to a network?

But of course if you absolutely must have that functionality wait for profile 2.0. Then you can bask in all those disks that feature silly portals, online stores and highscore tables to your heart's content.

Neutral

Jove @ Feb 21st 2008 3:09AM

Oh gawd. took them long enough to begin their bitchin bout it being more expensive! shut up! companies will being to compete with EACH OTHER!!! that so damn hard to understand??????? when did engadget come out? where you all bitching back in 2000 when dvd first started to come out, saying that it was gonna be a failure at such a high price? people were cool with vhs? the kidde console that was the ps2? that there was no need for such a niche product??????? huh huh huh huh?!?! man u people sure are annoying!

Low Ranked

Isaac @ Feb 21st 2008 3:43AM

Has anyone made the correlation between BD(bondage) and BD(bluray disc)? Some people really love bondage and $ony loves binding.

*How Toshiba could have won*
-Make better encryption(hell even throw in some root kits or spyware)
-Make inferior(unstandarized) hardware so consumers have upgrades to look forward to.
-Charge 3x as much for their hardware.
-Region lock disc to eliminate international freedom.
-Develop larger capacity disc so they can leave plenty of wasted space on them.
-And finally they should have come up with a really pretty name like 450nm Ray or something to that effect(HD-DVD is just too logical).

Neutral

Prey521 @ Feb 21st 2008 4:05AM

LOL that was pretty funny! +repped!

Highly Ranked

Blake @ Feb 21st 2008 6:02AM

"Make better encryption(hell even throw in some root kits or spyware)"

or how about any encryption which is of any use? HD DVD ~ (Copy of) the look and Sound of Perfect! Agreed, Toshiba would NEVER use spyware!....they prefer bloatware!

"Make inferior(unstandarized) hardware so consumers have upgrades to look forward to"

So when IS the next generation of superior Toshiba HD DVD players coming out? Oh and have you seen that video of those new Tosh drinks holders? They're great! Coming to a retailer near you for only $50! and you get 10 free coasters with it!

-Charge 3x as much for their hardware.

Yes follow Toshiba and sell above manufacturing cost...oh that didn't go so well. How about below cost? hmmm that didn't work so well either! How about giving away a stack of free movies with them? Tried that too! Damn! OK, lets rebadge our models! No-one will know the difference! Oops! Busted!

"Region lock disc to eliminate international freedom."

..Yeah lets screw the studios decision to release new titles early. Who cares! The whole world can buy the same disc 2 months late!....unless we can get our hands on one of those 1 dollar Chinese rips of course! After all, this is all about consumer freedom and friendliness!

"Develop larger capacity disc so they can leave plenty of wasted space on them."

Yeah! We don't need better encodes and uncompressed sound on the same disc! Wasteful! Hey, how is the development on that TL51 vaporware going?

"And finally they should have come up with a really pretty name like 450nm Ray or something to that effect(HD-DVD is just too logical)."

nah! just stick with the boring acronym! You should try getting some poor sod with a stutter to say it though. Very cruel!

Highest Ranked

klew @ Feb 21st 2008 4:22AM

Best Buy just didn't want to have to buy their employees red polo shirts.

Neutral

Prey521 @ Feb 21st 2008 5:32AM

HAHAHAHAHAHA!

Neutral

DrXym @ Feb 21st 2008 5:59AM

And the HD DVD one expires Feb 28th. If you intend to pick up a cheap HD DVD player do it in the next week.

Neutral

Anthony Pivac @ Feb 21st 2008 6:16AM

Sheesh -- tell the world how you really feel, why don'tcha?

Pot calling kettle black. This site has done this many times.

Anyway, at least this ad will get the attention of the public.

Neutral

Mike @ Feb 21st 2008 6:23AM

Since when did the Blu-Ray manufacturers stop competing? Or are they going to start now since HD-DVD is dead? Did HD-DVD stop Blu-Ray manufactures from competing? How much have prices dropped since CES?

What is the best deal today for a Blu-Ray player, PS3 ($399)? All I read is people buying the PS3 to play HD movies. If a Blu-Ray player comes in at $249 will people think the PS3 is a great deal anymore? Do you think Sony will allow their great system to be undercut? For the gamer who wants to play HD movies yeah it will be a great deal, but the average consumer could care less about games. Prices for Blu-Ray hardware will come down when the price of a PS3 comes down.

Neutral

Larry @ Feb 21st 2008 1:26PM

It is an artificial competition when all the players in the market are essentially price fixed. At $400 Blu-Ray will not win the only format war that matter. DVD vs Blu-Ray.

Neutral

Killer @ Feb 21st 2008 6:33AM

Why would you put a samsung blu-ray player on the ad? nice move best buy, put a player that is getting a class action lawsuit on it for being crippled in what it does. Why not put another player that has a better reputation.

Highest Ranked

ccweems @ Feb 21st 2008 6:52AM

We got way too many readers with short memories, hopefully their shortcomings are lmited to just their memories.

When CD's came out (I am very old) I patiently waited for Sony's second generation player to come out for $400! I'm sure adjusted for inflation it must be like $1500 now and I was happy to pay it. Same thing when DVD's came out, the second generation player cost $400. My second generation battery powered portable cost $1000 and I'm still using it. At the time there were plenty of folk that remarked "I wouldn't pay that" just like many of the readers here.

Be patient, prices will come down just maybe not as fast as you would like. The CE companies are not evil but they too have to be patient. While I haven't opened up a current HD player I bet they look like my first CD player; big circuit boards with lots of discrete components which weigh a surprising amount and require a lot of power. If you want to see the future read the IC industry magazines, you'll soon be reading about various companies announcing IC's combining multiple functions into one package. This shrinks real estate, cost and weight. Go pick up a $29 DVD player: why is it so cheap? The package is obviously smaller because there is hardly anything inside, a few chips requiring a tiny power supply. The design and manufacture of such players has reduced the parts count to nearly nothing. Remember that at $29 everybody is still making money!

The expectation for existing player manufacturers to jump off the same financial cliff as Toshiba's is naive. We all know where that leads. Current prices are probably as low as manufacturers can sell considering their parts count. Get a grip, stop your bitch'in and save your money. You may not be part of the current market but it will come to you.

Neutral

hemmy @ Feb 21st 2008 1:25PM

great post, ccweems.

Neutral

Tony @ Feb 21st 2008 10:18AM

Is this $399 bargain a profile 2.0 internet ready ?

Neutral

indadogghouse @ Feb 21st 2008 10:47AM

MSRP for the Toshiba drives were $299 for the A3, $399 for the A30, and $499 for the A35. Realistic pricing would've been around $200, $300, and $400, if Toshiba wasn't in desperation mode.
So, remember, "WE ARE IN EARLY ADOPTATION" (less than 2 years), so this is historically NORMAL, prices are going to be high at the get go. That being said, BD players still do sit at a higher price break than HD DVD on par with the A30/A35 in terms of specs.

What I don't get is why BD players do not offer the same options as the HD DVDs did. The A3 is 1080i, the A30 doesn't do all the audio decoding in the drive, the A35 does it all.

A BD player with similar specs to the A3 I'm sure would've appealed to a larger audience. So what if it's 1080i? This would appeal to those with just a 1080i only TV. This would've appealed to new 1080p owners as well. A lot of the new 1080p HDTVs do deinterlacing and inverse telecine perfectly, so you do not need 1080p output from the player, so why not save some dough?

I keep reading in forums about "better" components in BD vs. HD DVD drives. I don't understand, better how?

Highly Ranked

Noone @ Feb 21st 2008 10:56AM

just buy a ps3...

Neutral

RCMe @ Feb 21st 2008 11:18AM

Interesting comments. However, the "format war" had nothing to do with consumers or even the price of the players (as could be seen by no dramatic overwhelming increase is sales when Toshiba lowered prices).

No, this format war was all about who could pay off the studios first (and Sony with Blu-Ray clearly won this battle and ultimately won the war). This really had nothing to do with consumer purchasing power and probably even less with the actual disk format. It was all about the exclusive deals with studios to support only a single format.

A real format war would have been one were studios supported both formats equally (no exclusive "behind the scenes" or "under the table" deals with studios to only provide content on one format). Where the manufacturers had to sell their products and convince consumers which format was best based on the merits of the format, price of players, etc., without exclusive studio deals forcing consumers into one format because that is the only format on which the movie is available.

Neutral

Truth Teller @ Feb 21st 2008 1:31PM

If there's no competition between consumer electronics companies then DVD players should still be $600-$1000, which is what they were in 1997.

You people who think, like Rob Enderle, that there won't be a profile 2.0 player out by Christmas for a price around $200 are kidding yourselves. It's like you just landed on Earth and don't know anything about anything!

As for mass market, DVD took nearly three years to have one title sell a million copies and 7 years to outrent VHS. It must be HD DVD crybabies that think if prices don't come down by next week it's all done for and oh, they're so hard done by. There's a reason the HD DVD players were as low as $109 and it wasn't cost, it was desperation. There's a reason why only one manufacturer made HD DVD players and it WAS cost - Toshiba priced everyone else out of the HD DVD game.

If $399 is too expensive, wait until this Christmas. It's no different than any other technology. Get a grip.

Neutral

RCMe @ Feb 21st 2008 2:40PM

Sorry, but the consumers did NOT decide the war. The war was decided by content exclusivity. I have no stake in Blu-ray or HD-DVD (don't own either player and will wait until Blu-ray player prices are below $200 before buying one).

This is a simple study in economics. In the case HD-DVD, if the movies people want to watch are not available in the HD-DVD format, then the HD-DVD players could pretty much be free, and consumers would not buy them. Where do I get Pirates of the Caribbean for HD-DVD? Or Cars on HD-DVD? Or Spiderman on HD-DVD? Oh-ya, can't, these are exclusive on Blu-ray, so the only way to watch those movies is to buy a Blu-ray player. The same holds true for the titles exclusive to the HD-DVD format.

As a result, this "war" was really all about content exclusivity and who could get the most studios locked into a single format the quickest. That is what decided this war. As soon as the first studio announced support for only one format, the consumer was out of the picture. So, the consumer, while they "played the game", were really not part of the war and ultimately had little impact on its outcome (I would expect, over the course, that the ratio of Blu-ray vs. HD-DVD sales pretty much reflects the ratio of content exclusivity).

In any case, kudos to Sony for ponying up the payola to pay off more studios into signing exclusive Blu-ray agreements. Toshiba clearly dropped the ball here. Economically, I'm sure it will work for them, as I expect they will recoup may times over whatever they paid studios like Warner to go exclusive.

The alternative, where all the studios equally support both formats, would have clearly put the consumer in charge of deciding the war, something I expect neither the manufacturers or studios wanted to have happen for their own economic reasons (i.e. price wars).

Neutral

JBDragon @ Feb 22nd 2008 1:46AM

Forget that DRM infested rushed out to the marketplace unfinished format Blu-Ray. Stick with the winning format for another 10+ years to come, DVD!!! Blu-Ray is just not worth it.

Highly Ranked

Insightful @ Feb 22nd 2008 9:01AM

Sorry, but the consumers did decide the war. They bought more Blu-ray Disc players in December 60/40 over HD DVD. They consistently bought more titles on Blu-ray Disc than they did on HD DVD, over 60 weeks straight, and consistently bought more copies of titles released on both formats on the Blu-ray Disc format, particularly the big day and date titles like The Departed, 300, Harry Potter 5, etc.

The only people that think the consumer didn't decide and that it's so unfair that HD DVD lost are people who allowed themselves to become emotionally attached to the HD DVD format. You should have paid attention to reality and not the propaganda merchants like Amir Majidimehr and Rob Enderle. It's your own fault.

Neutral

hit_escape @ Feb 23rd 2008 6:09PM

Now that HDDVD is "dead", can I have some inexpensive, simple tools to easily burn my own HDDVD's on plain 'ol DVD's and play them on my obsolete HDDVD player? Oh, and if they'd done this in the first place, everyone would be sayin' "What's Blu-ray?" That's my $.02

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