In the
Q&A session following Toshiba's HD DVD dumping event in Japan, Atsutoshi Nishida, President and CEO of Toshiba Corporation made a bit of a surprise announcement. While it remains committed to standard DVD, they have "no plan at all at this moment" to take up the Blu-ray format. He also stated that Tosh has no plans for a next-next gen format at all. Perhaps they are just licking their wounds until HD downloads become a reality.
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
DrXym @ Feb 19th 2008 3:56AM
Toshiba will have to support Blu Ray. In corporate speak "no plans" means "our options are open and we're thinking about it but at this very minute we have nothing concrete to say". Furthermore it makes no sense they wouldn't seeing as joint owners of a factory that makes (drumroll) Blu Ray drives. TSST (Toshiba Samsung Storage Technology) makes OEM storage components and it's probably where Samsung gets its drives from. Wouldn't surprise me at all if Toshiba sells a rebadged Samsung player this year to catch the holidays and their own in-house models next year.
EEL @ Feb 19th 2008 4:28AM
@ DrXym,
Well said.
I was thinking they just hold out until Profile 2.0 and lower overall manufacturing cost were the norms before releasing a Blu player with their badge.
But what you said trumps it.
Raptor007 @ Feb 19th 2008 3:13PM
Toshiba doesn't want to go crawling to the BDA just yet, and there's no need for them to rush; they have plenty of other sources of income (including SD-DVD). I also doubt they want to try to make a Blu-ray player quite yet; not until the profiles are sorted out and compatibility is better.
I hope that when Toshiba does go Blu, they'll also offer combo players. I'd probably be the best way to get HD-DVD early adopters to get into Blu-ray.
Prey521 @ Feb 19th 2008 4:27AM
LOL at people complaining about Enola Blu-Ray pic. I think it's tastelessly hilarious!
Alex @ Feb 19th 2008 8:33AM
A picture of the burning twin towers with "HDDVD" written on it would be hilarious too.
Oh, too soon ?
Ridiculous picture.
borland502 (SDF - Macross Ring) @ Feb 19th 2008 9:48AM
A good point Alex, but at what point does tragedy become fair game? Bill and Ted made light of Khaaaaaan, the Mogul butcher of yesteryear. Monty Python has made sketches of the Black Death...so what's the time limit on these things?
RN @ Feb 19th 2008 10:26AM
Hiroshima and Nagasaki were nothing like 9/11. Japan attacked the US first in an attacked depicted in the horrible Michael Bay flick, Pearl Harbor. (I had to get that in there for sake of relevance to the format war.) The US military weighed its options for ending the Pacific theater and nuking Japan won because the alternative was an estimated additional 1 million US soldiers dead. It also ended the war in a matter of days rather than dragging it on for potentially years. While 9/11 was about a radical group of Islamo-fascists that hate everything about America and what it stands for.
Elad @ Feb 19th 2008 11:05AM
Or so we're told...
Alex @ Feb 19th 2008 11:08AM
@borland502 (SDF - Macross Ring)
I didn't mean to imply there is a time limit, I don't think there is one, I was mostly asking if it was ok to make light off recent events as it seems to be for ~63 years old one.
@RN
My point was, that it's not cool to compare tragic events, foreign or not, old or not, to a stupid format war.
My bad for the post down, meant to reply here.
pquistgard @ Feb 19th 2008 4:47AM
They always have "no plans" and then come out with the announcement. That's been shown time and time again. (with many companis)
GhostDoggy @ Feb 19th 2008 4:50AM
Toshiba can say whatever it wants to, because consumers are not going to be buying their products much longer. Between them and their decisive victory over Blu-ray in the DVD Forum standards battle, the end result is a consumer-losing condition that will leave bad feelings towards the leader of HD DVD.
I supported both formats, but I can only imagine those that chose to focus only on HD DVD.
locke6854 @ Feb 19th 2008 5:16AM
sorry toshiba, your Cell processor is already playing tons of blu-ray discs everywhere.
KayRazy Ken Kutaragi @ Feb 19th 2008 8:43AM
Allow me to clear up some missconceptions about Toshiba OWNING the CELL plants. You see, Sony did indeed sell Toshiba manufacturing capabilities of the vaunted Cell, however it sold Toshiba the rights to the 90nm and 65nm plants NOT the newer more efficient and much cheaper 45nm plants.
So you see boys and girls Sony STILL has controll over the CELL.
Gods I love FUD that gets spread with no REAL thought as to what really happened.
Do you really think Sony would spend that much time and effort on a revolutionary CPU and just GIVE IT AWAY?
superklye @ Feb 19th 2008 11:11AM
@KRKK
Uh, yeah, when they're reporting record losses and have as much debt as they do, I would expect them to sell whatever they could to prevent going under.
And that's just what they did.
eugene @ Feb 19th 2008 5:26AM
who cares, I'm just waiting for the firesales.
Hans Martin @ Feb 19th 2008 5:45AM
"who cares, I'm just waiting for the firesales."
You mean the ones that's been going on since November last year?
Maybe Toshibas biggest problem was that it's supporters is such cheap bastards :-)
(no offense!)
eugene @ Feb 19th 2008 6:14AM
sorry, but BOGOF offers aren't a fire sale. And if that's the benchmark, well, amazon and BB have had both.
I'm talking about a FIRESALE. everything must go at rock bottom prices.
Why would I want to pay a measely 10 dollars off of retail when there's a chance to pay much lower? But then, i guess that's why Blu-Ray did so well, it's fanboys are willing to pay top dollar for everything. Hey, no offense.
Hans Martin @ Feb 19th 2008 6:38AM
"But then, i guess that's why Blu-Ray did so well, it's fanboys are willing to pay top dollar for everything. Hey, no offense."
None taken -- it settled the war and insured our investment :-)
John B @ Feb 19th 2008 9:34AM
"Maybe Toshibas biggest problem was that it's supporters is such cheap bastards :-)"
Gee, I can't understand why so many HD DVD supporters find many BD supporters to be such contemptible, elitist snobs, can you?
ceilingfanboy @ Feb 19th 2008 10:29AM
@John B
What he says makes sense. The problem was that Toshiba was trying to target the people who were not willing to pay $300-$1000 for a player. The people who are not willing to pay that much for a player are also the people who were afraid to buy a lot of movies because they couldn't risk the money. Marketing to people who are afraid of losing money doesn't work too well in a format war where buying into it at all is a gamble. For the average person, if they waited until the war was over, they had to wait later to start their collections, but everything would be cheaper by that time, whereas if they bought in early, even if they chose the right format they only gained a head start on others of getting their movies, but at a higher cost. It's not like they could have made money by gambling in this war.
Ryan @ Feb 19th 2008 8:37PM
This doesn't make any sense. You guys are talking like anything the consumer did ever mattered in this format war. News flash fellas, it didn't.
What kind of consumers they targetted, and whether or not their buyers were cheap or rich had absolutely zero affect on this war. This war was fought way above our heads, with big business between the manufacturers and the studios. Stop trying to pretend anything you or I or any of us ever did in this war was relevant even for a second. All of the major blu-ray studios had picked their side before a single consumer ever bought a single player except for Warner, and they picked blu because it already had more studio support.
Consumers never mattered in this thing. Not for a second.
Reapman @ Feb 19th 2008 11:12AM
@JohnB
Actually there is some truth of it... This stuff is geared for people willing to spend $2000 on a TV. If your willing to spend that much on a TV, chances are your also willing to spend more then $100 on a freakin player. Eventually yes, every Tom Dick and Harry will want HD, and all they'll look at is the price tag, but right now the market is people who have excess money to blow on entertainment. $400 or $150 for a player is peanuts, especially when the $400 player was supported by much more of Hollywood. Sometimes cost ISNT the #1 priority for people.
I mean who in their right mind would buy an HD or BD player to watch on a 10 year old, 32 inch TV like what 90% of people own right now?
John B @ Feb 19th 2008 11:15AM
I disagree. Toshiba was hoping to do what ink-jet printer manufacturers do -- take a loss on the initial purchase and make it back on media sales. They were hoping that people would have been more apt to look at it as "a BD player for $500, or an HD DVD player plus a number of movies for the same price". In this case their gamble lost. So be it.
My point is that the BD fanboys have had this pathetic association that HD DVD owners are "cheap bastards", even going so far as to tell people to find a better job! (Just to buy a BD player?! WTF!) Apparently, they have no clue of the word "value" nor do they understand that the value they have towards an item does not constitute the same value to others. They then hide behind the snobbery that because they put a higher value on BD, anyone who doesn't agree with that value assessment is a "Joe Six Pack" or a "cheap bastard". That's exactly the kind of snobbery that has infested the BD camp and is exactly what pushed me to support HD DVD over BD, even though I believe that BD is a technology is superior and I originally supported BD over HD DVD when this whole thing began.
The continuing "sore winner syndrome" that so many BD fanboys are showing just further pushes me to enjoy upconverted DVDs.
John B @ Feb 19th 2008 11:20AM
@Ryan:
"Consumers never mattered in this thing. Not for a second."
Hear, hear!
Once studio exclusivity started, true consumer choice between HD formats disappeared. If it was a truly level playing field - equal media for all three formats (SDVD, BD, HD DVD) - only then would this war have TRULY been decided by the consumers.
Reapman @ Feb 19th 2008 12:52PM
@ John B, again:
Your not going to seriously base your purchasing on what random people on a web forum say, are you? I might as well say that after listening to people like nfinity and truth teller, I am glad that HD-DVD lost. Which would be pretty sad.
Base your decisions on the technical merit of the equipment, not because you don't like some people that own it. I know annoying XBox 360 owners, should I not buy a 360?
John B @ Feb 19th 2008 2:17PM
@Reapman:
I have no intention of putting my dollars (A) to a player that's 4-5x what I paid for my existing player when I don't watch much of my HD DVD movies as is, and (B) to show support to a format that was pushed with a lot of backroom deals as well as rude and denigrating fanboys. You can call the latter reason spite, stubborness, etc. I don't care if you agree with my reasons or not.
If you don't like the actions of those who support any particular cause, you have a tendency to not want to contribute to that cause, whether it's PETA, Greenpeace, or various political parties. I don't like the actions of the BD crowd and the venom they've shown and STILL CONTINUE TO SHOW towards HD DVD and those who dared to purchase a player. I have therefore chosen not to support BD at this time. That doesn't mean that I expect people to agree with me nor does it mean that I won't purchase a player in the future.
If you read through the history of this format war, I think you'll find that a LOT of people were turned off to BD not because of the technology but because of the childishness of the fanboys.
segu @ Feb 19th 2008 5:47AM
Though I am Japanese
The image of the article felt it very unpleasantly though Toshiba was not a too
favorite enterprise in me.
zara @ Feb 19th 2008 6:09AM
I agree with you. It's a shame.
Matt @ Feb 19th 2008 7:30AM
I agree. ひどいね。
how did you feel when microsoft called the first xbox "project midway?"
here is the link(日本語版)
http://blog.livedoor.jp/plus10a/archives/cat_21731.html
KayRazy Ken Kutaragi @ Feb 19th 2008 8:48AM
Give me a break. I am half Japanese and I lived in Japan. Get over WWII. Japan WAS the aggressor in WWII. Japan raped ALL of SE Asia starting in 1933. Japan attacked Pearl. And Japan showed just how fanantical and bloody the invasion of the homeland would be when the US invaded Iwo Jima.
Dropping Little Boy and Fat Man SAVED countless millions of US and JAPANESE lives.
Now Japan and the US are close Allies and Japan owns our living rooms.
A big WAH goes out to you sir.
Keith @ Feb 19th 2008 6:16AM
Come on, they are not going to announce Blu-ray support at the SAME conference they cull HD DVD.
They ARE working on Blu-ray, they will continue to develop a player, and when the dust has settled in a few months time, and the product(s) are closer to being ready, THEN they will announce them...
You would have to be an idiot to believe that Toshiba would confirm Blu-ray support at the HD DVD funeral.
alienclays @ Feb 19th 2008 8:25AM
heh, would it be too much to ask them to make combo players? maybe even leave off the hd-dvd badges but leave the funtionality in there.
whn @ Feb 19th 2008 6:31AM
YOU GUYS ARE A BUNCH OF IDIOTS SUPPORTING CORRUPTION, PAYOLA and ELIMINATION OF CONSUMER PROTECTION.
READ ABOUT THE 1948 PARAMOUNT DECREE.
YOU GUYS ARE IDIOTS
YOU JUST VOTED THE MPAA TO RUN YOUR HOME MEDIA.
YOU JUST SUPPORTED WHAT FIDEL CASTRO USED TO DO, PAY OFF EVERYONE.
NO WONDER THE ANNOUNCEMENT COMES AT THE SAME TIME.
THE DEATH OF ONE COMMUNISM, STARTS ANOTHER WITH THIS STUDIO COLLUSION.
I LOVE YOU MPAA!
IDIOTS.
D@n @ Feb 19th 2008 7:04AM
Hello HD4ME!
Another tissue?
Mr. E @ Feb 19th 2008 7:38AM
WTF? Take off your tinfoil hat, look around, and slooooowly open your eyes to reality? 'k?
John B @ Feb 19th 2008 9:45AM
@whn/I LOVE THE MPAA:
I consider myself to be an HD DVD supporter more than a BD hater because I don't hate BD per se, just the numerous snobs within its supporter ranks. That said ... you, sir, are a f**king moron.
Geoffrey Sperl @ Feb 19th 2008 10:47AM
And here I thought Loud Howard disappeared when "Dilbert" went off the air.
HD4ME @ Feb 22nd 2008 7:52AM
@D@n
NO! I'm here F'K Head, i don't need to hide behind other names, so go F'K yourself jackass. Typical blu troll, go back rimming with your boyfriend, it suits you.
Besides, I DONT USE CAPSLOCK... wanker!
D@n @ Feb 19th 2008 7:04AM
See post above...
mugatu @ Feb 19th 2008 7:20AM
If Toshiba really won't produce Blu-Ray players, which I don't really believe, then the only reason is because they know they won't be competitive. Why not? Because they can do one of two things: dump players on the market way below cost like they did with HD DVD, or try to make a profit which means higher prices that former HD DVD consumers will go nuts over. Since there is no reason to operate at a loss because there is no format war to try to steal, Toshiba would rather take their ball and go home. Believe it.
misterhearn @ Feb 19th 2008 7:29AM
Well, I will wait for the liquidation sales to come about and ironically give my HD DVD player more use than ever, but as an Xbox 360 owner that doesnt really want to buy a PS3 just yet, I wonder will M$ make nice with blu ray? The BDA boss said they were welcomed to join the BDA however that could have been gloating in some way. I wonder if M$ is purely focused on digital downloads now? Or will we see a Blu Ray add on at the top of most Xbox 360 owners Christmas wish list?
Well I guess I can just hold my breath until I turn blu
Jimbob @ Feb 19th 2008 7:32AM
Of course they say no plans, having "plans" means having to answer
"Is your BD player out yet?"
"Is your BD player out yet?"
"Is your BD player out yet?"
"Is your BD player out yet?"
"Is your BD player out yet?"
"Is your BD player out yet?"
to every punter/journo
better to say no plans until you have something to show.
The fact is they are already set up for HD movie player manufacturing, more so than probably even Sony who are concentrating on the PS3.
Mr. E @ Feb 19th 2008 7:41AM
My take: Toshiba is absolutely going to support Blu-ray, but they're in no hurry. The market is still small, and they don't have a licensing stake in the technology, so they can take their time and jump in when people have left the bad feelings of the format war behind them.
Mike Peluso @ Feb 19th 2008 8:02AM
Toshiba didn't handle the exit well, but I'm thinking they are still emotionally experiencing something akin to when a someone comes home to find their spouse gone. In this case the abdoning spouse (Warner) left a few weeks ago and Toshiba is admitting the marriage is over and their will be a divorce.. If any of you know someone who's been through a divorce, you know that the best decisions aren't made when in the middle of that process.
Mike Peluso @ Feb 19th 2008 8:08AM
one more thing... upon reflection, I'm feeling more and more certain that Blu-ray won because of it's advanced DRM. More DRM = more studio support.
Unless it's transparent, More DRM usually means less consumer adoption. It will be very interesting to see how strong the adoption will be especially if the studios try to keep the disc prices high.
Blu Ray won the first major battle, but will they win the war?
Mr Stevo @ Feb 19th 2008 9:39AM
Dude, get off the "Blu-ray prices are high" nonsense. I think prices for Blu-ray have dropped faster than for SD-DVD movies. You can find "3:10 to Yuma" for $24, and many more between $19-26. That's not too bad for a new release. Once HD-DVD is out, prices will stabilize and new releases in Blu-ray will go for about $21-24, and SD-DVD $17-19. Just remember how it was when DVD took over and the prices of VHS went down. However, if you do all your shopping for movies at Target, then I understand why you say HD is so expensive. However, if you shop online, you'd get great prices from Amazon, Buy.com, and many more retailers.
JBDragon @ Feb 20th 2008 1:20AM
Or, now that HD DVD is out of the game and there's no more BOGO sales, prices will stay high, maybe go up. There's Reasons for the new HD format, and being HD is on the bottom of the list!
#1. Much better DRM over DVD. They want control back again.
#2. Sell Hardware at higher prices. DVD players are so cheap these day there's not much money in it and it's also getting stagnate.
#3. Sell HD movies at a higher price. Same reasons as #2 as Movie release prices are cheap and drop fast, yet they can't charge more money as people won't go for it. A new HD format changes that.
#4. To have a HD
Anything else.
misterhearn @ Feb 19th 2008 8:10AM
Ok, maybe somebody can help me with this one, if M$ does in fact join up with the BDA an BR add on is possible right? Or could Sony stop them from doing this since it would possibly hurt PS3 sales?
To my knowledge a company such as LG whom makes BR players has a licensing agreement to make BR decks right? So that would mean they can make an add on for the Xbox 360 and Sony really would just have to eat it right? I'm no legal expert so I'm not sure how this would work, or could Sony just say NO! and that be it?
I guess we'll wait and see.
JBDragon @ Feb 20th 2008 1:29AM
Sony can't Stop MS from releasing a Blu-Ray drive. That's just stupid. MS never made any HD DVD drives anyway, it was Toshiba. MS just backed the better format that was using the much better HDi software then the BD-J that Blu-Ray supports. In either case MS Compression format VC-1 is in BOTH HD DVD and Blu-Ray. So really MS is in every single Blu-Ray player out there!!! Get a brain. If MS releases a Blu-Ray add-on for the 360, I still won't buy it. I will have nothing to do with Blu-Ray.
Sony can't stop someone else from Making a Blu-Ray player. They are just a Member, of course they're a MAJOR Member and most Blu-Ray players out there now are from SONY. Most being the PS3, but Sony has Stand Alone players out there also so it seems like it's all SONY and in a way it is.
HD Guy @ Feb 19th 2008 8:26AM
Don't fool yourself "no plans to adopt Blu-Ray" doesn't mean "we'll go Blu-Ray if we have to," it means "we'll continue to do whatever we can to torpedo Blu-Ray just prove that we weren't the rea; losers, only the first loser."