Samsung sued for defective Blu-ray players
We'll be straight with you -- we aren't surprised one iota by this one. For those keeping tabs, Samsung's slate of Blu-ray players have been plagued with issues essentially from day one, and while it has released a flurry of firmware updates over the years in an attempt to mend a variety of incompatibility issues, even its recent BD-UP5000 hybrid player is being axed early on after giving owners all sorts of fits. Apparently, one particular buyer isn't taking things lying down, and has decided to file suit against the mega-corp alleging that it has sold "defective Blu-ray players" to consumers. According to the suit, Sammy was "fully aware of the defective nature of the player [BD-P1200, in particular] at the time of manufacture and sale," and it also claims that the firm has "failed to provide a remedy consistent with the products' intended and represented uses." More specifically, the verbiage picks on the units' inability to play back select BD titles, and while some fixes have indeed been doled out, we still get the feeling many consumers have been left dissatisfied. Needless to say, this outcome should be interesting.
[Thank, Nfinity and Prey521]
[Thank, Nfinity and Prey521]

















Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
JVirg1 @ Feb 9th 2008 11:38AM
Not surprising at all. I really wanted to get a blu-ray player and found that none of them were worth buying. People have wrote of HD DVD (myself included), but perhaps this war is not over. I think if there was a decent Blu-Ray player at decent prices this war would have been over a long time ago. Anyhow, I bought Eastern Promisses on HD DVD and enjoyed it a lot. I have a PS3, but other than the SpiderMan that came with it have not watched anything else. And let's face it, SpiderMan 3 does not do that series proud. My heart is still with HD DVD and I decided that if they have a movie I want I will buy it. The fact is HD DVD is just better. I guess in the end the better technology is not the issue, it is backing. Ya gotta give Toshiba props though for hanging in there. And you just never know what can happen. I was shocked to see HD DVD back almost even with Blu-ay on the Amazon charts even with a big sale.
mntwister @ Feb 9th 2008 11:50AM
The big sale on Amazon is for hd-dvd, that is why the graph looks the way it does. When the sale is over, as has been the pattern every time, the red graph drops to the lowest level of the chart. Blu ray has no sale right now at all and is still above the hd-dvd with a big 50% off sale.
I do agree with you on the player issue. Panasonics have had very few problems and the Sony stand-alones too. It's the Samsungs that are crap, so please don't give all of the manufacturers the bum log.
KayRazy Ken Kutaragi @ Feb 9th 2008 12:00PM
Why do you want to buy a BD player when you already have the BEST one? The PS3 is the best player available as the Cell effortlessly decodes the BD movie at lightning quick speeds.
B4 Truthteller and Nfinity chime in with Blugay sucks or whatever...the Samsung players in question are having trouble playing some BD movies AND HDDVD movies, so it has nothing to do with Blu and everything to do with Microsoft-like quality.
JVirg1 @ Feb 9th 2008 12:06PM
To KayRazy Ken Kutaragi
I should have been more clear. I just bought the PS3 two weeks ago. I am not a gamer and have not played video games since I was a kid and had an Atari 2600, so was not really looking for a video game system. But after doing research on all the Blu-Ray players the PS3 was the only one that made sense. On a positive note I bought Call of Duty 4 and Wow games have come a long way. I feel like a kid again. But for movies I still just prefer my HD DVD. I am sue as time goes on and IF (and that is if and not when) Blu-Ray picks up I will eventually grow to like it. I sure do know how to pick a loser though, I still have my Beta VCR.
KayRazy Ken Kutaragi @ Feb 9th 2008 12:20PM
Do you prefer HDDVD because of the exclusive movies? Perhaps the interactivity? As far as PQ goes, they are identical. I do think that H.264 or Mpeg4 or AVC looks a bit crisper than VC1.
Yes VG's have come a long way since the 2600. Even if you never play a VG on your PS3's it still has so much more functionality. For example it can...
Store digital fotos and display them a few different ways including facial recognition
Store digital music and play them with some cool visualizers
Surf the Internet
Store and play HDmovies that you DL or convert yourself
If you have the PSEYE you can video conference with others
Install Linux and you have a PC
Remote play with a PSP
and not to mention the upcoming HOME service and the ability to DL new firmware updates that will continually expand the capabilities of the PS3.
JVirg1 @ Feb 9th 2008 12:34PM
To KayRazy Ken Kutaragi
I am sure it is a few reasons. First my HD DVD has better sound. My year and a half old Onkyo receiver does not have HDMI inputs only analog. I am not about to run out and replace that because Blu-Ray can't do things to make it convenient for consumers. With my HD DVD I can get the lossless audio so it sounds better. There is no decently priced Blu-Ray player besides the Samsung 1400 (and I was not about to buy that for obvious reasons) that give me that ability. And my HD DVD player upconverts better. I am amazed at how good SD movies look on it (still 90% of that I watch). And lastly it does seem I prefer the selections I was getting with HD DVD. I am not a big Disney fan, and don't like the kind of company Sony is (you're with us or against us). But Sony made a smart move putting the Blu-ray player in the PS3, making them hard to beat. As for HD Quality between the players, like I said I only saw Spiderman 3 on the Blu-Ray and it was good quality, but not a great movie. Someday my 5 free movies will come and I can check a few of them out, but the selection they gave was horrible so not like I am checking the mail everyday in anticipation. When the last nail is in HD DVD's coffin I guess I will have to give in and learn to love Blu-Ray. Not gonna happen overnight though.
kcmurphy88 @ Feb 11th 2008 11:37AM
Now we need someone to go after the blu-ray cartel that is colluding to drive prices back up. These payments and such (yes, even the one to Paramount) are exactly the kind of thing that used to be illegal back before the Bush folks stopped enforcing the law. Imagine the screaming if Microsoft bought off Warner and Fox. Why is it OK when Sony does it?
wireless.nemo @ Feb 9th 2008 11:50AM
LOL.
bullied by nfinty much? :rolleyes:
John B @ Feb 9th 2008 8:15PM
Jesus... EngadgetHD just can't win, can they? If they show anything showing HD DVD in a bad light, they're just a bunch of BD fanboys. If they show something bad in the Bluray arena, they've been bullied into it. :/
Vidikron (FU) @ Feb 9th 2008 8:27PM
@John B
Yup... and the HD DVD camp accuses them of being a "Blu" site on a nearly daily basis.
locke6854 @ Feb 10th 2008 7:47AM
and blu-ray.com forums thinks that because engadgethd reports something OTHER than blu-ray occasionally that they are a hd dvd biased site.
ryan @ Feb 9th 2008 11:54AM
this doesnt suprise me samsung has had a lot of problems with the bd-p1200 my dad has one worst player weve ever bought samsung is making blu ray look bad by not having decent blu ray players on the market all the other manufacturers however are doing a great job making blu ray players profile 2.0 players will solve all the disc compatibility issues cant wait for the new sony and panasonic players this spring it is a fact though that early adopters usually suffer
John Drinkwater @ Feb 9th 2008 12:07PM
Likely outcome: new firmware for old players, adding new Blu-ray functions. Awesome win!
( :P )
Truth Teller @ Feb 9th 2008 12:14PM
That's better, nice to see (for a change, in the last few months) something less than stellar on the Blu-ray side of the street get reported here.
The Blu-ray fanclub should quite pretending only Samsung players have problems or are buggy.
All Blu-ray players (including the PS3 game console) have been reported (by owners) as having various issues at various times.
Some of that is perfectly normal considering the newness of the tech.
But sadly that sort of fair consideration is rarely returned when the issues relate to some HD DVD players or discs, eh guys?
KayRazy Ken Kutaragi @ Feb 9th 2008 12:23PM
I cannot speak for everyone like you can but for me I have had ZERO problems with my PS3 when playing back BD movies. In fact, they load up in under 5 seconds and I have seen how long the stand alones on both sides can take.
Truth Teller @ Feb 9th 2008 12:27PM
@ KayRazy Ken Kutaragi
Good for you.
But you are hardly representitive of every PS3 owner.
The various games forums & format forums are full of people reporting issues even with the PS3.
So please do not insult anyone's intelligence by pretending that the PS3 has been & is totally free of issues.
KayRazy Ken Kutaragi @ Feb 9th 2008 12:33PM
"So please do not insult anyone's intelligence by pretending that the PS3 has been & is totally free of issues."
Take your HDDVD glasses off and read what I wrote please...I cannot speak for everyone I cannot speak for everyone I cannot speak for everyone I cannot speak for everyone I cannot speak for everyone I cannot speak for everyone
but for me I have had ZERO problems with my PS3 when playing back BD movies. but for me I have had ZERO problems with my PS3 when playing back BD movies. but for me I have had ZERO problems with my PS3 when playing back BD movies. but for me I have had ZERO problems with my PS3 when playing back BD movies.
Man dude, you seem like an informed intelligent person when it comes to Home Theatre but your rampant support for HDDVD blinds you to reason kinda like religion blinds people to ignorance or reason.
Is Toshiba your GOD?
mcrexx @ Feb 9th 2008 12:41PM
Ya like the HD-DVD players have been problem free. Just go over to the HD-DVD hardware forums on AVS and see how many lock ups, cold reboots, bricked players, stuttering and LFE problems every HD-DVD player has had. Even my A1 has had issues from time to time, especially with newer movies.
DrXym @ Feb 9th 2008 2:05PM
Truth Teller, the PS3 is an exceptionally reliable device. Attempting to spin otherwise is pathetic even for you.
Have people had issues? Of course they have. Tell me any device ever that has 100% reliability. The general consensus though is that it is extremely well engineered and reliable piece of kit.
Student Driver @ Feb 9th 2008 2:48PM
Toshiba may be his god, but only because Sony is the true Satan.
However, after stating that I believe the PS3 is the most versatile of the units and the one I will probably get myself.
As for the topic, I am a Samsung fan and disappointed that it got this bad for them. I am one of the people that the Samsung LN-T4671 works great for, but there are enough people with issues that there's obviously an issue that can't be ignored. Then again, my LCD was made last month with the newest components and firmware, and that might be why mine is so good; they are trying to fix it. Maybe all the existing customers will get upgraded to the newest BR player?
Miguelito @ Feb 11th 2008 3:22AM
Student Driver...
Sony may be a satan, but the HD side has Microsoft as part of its team, so both camps suck when it comes down to it.
I've also been a big Samsung fan for most things (seriously eyeing their 72" DLP set for an upgrade) but I also had a seriously bad experience with their 250Gig HM-250JI drive which seems like it had serious design flaws from all the hits I got on the net about issues. Ironically my custom bathroom countertops and sinks were made by Samsung.. never knew they did that kind of thing until I got them. My parents also have a Samsung fridge that they just love. Every now and then everyone makes a mistake though.
As an owner of both a PS3 and a 360 with the HD add-on.. I've also (YMMV) never had a single issue with playback or functionality with BD movies (I own about 40 BD movies to about 10 HD movies) but have had continual issues on the HD side. From HDi locking up playback on the 360 until I completely erase caches and then disable the network functionality to movies that just won't play back (Bourne Ultimatum became unplayable after about 2/3 in)... the HD side has seriously let me down.
When it comes to the HDM disc wars, I'm leaning BD based on my own experiences. The price differences still suck, but they'll come down once the "war" is completely over anyway.
Mike @ Feb 9th 2008 12:52PM
AND YOU WANT TO TELL ME THAT BLU RAY IS THE BETTER CHOICE!!!!!
LOL! One more reason why HD DVD is better. It's tragic because it shows that Blu-Ray player manufacturers cares more about the profit than the customer because if they cared about the customer they would take all these junky Blu Ray players and throw them off a cliff.
Toshiba cares about the customer because they're not selling overpriced under spec-ed garbage. Why doesn't anybody see this.
JimC @ Feb 9th 2008 12:57PM
Mike, tell me, do you think Samsung is THE ONLY BLU-RAY MANUFACTURER???!!! Stop with the intellectual dishonesty. Samsung is but 1 of many blu-ray manufacturers and they happen to have not a good record. All others have faired much better and the $399 PS3 is one of the best Media PC's out there that happens to have blu-ray built in....
DrXym @ Feb 9th 2008 2:13PM
Mike, Blu Ray is a standard successfully implemented by multiple companies. Yet its Blu Ray's fault that one particular company has botched 2 players, one of them being a BD / HD DVD hybrid? Of course it isn't and it's absurd to suggest it.
Do you also moan MP3 is broken if an MP3 player contains glitches or USB is hosed if memory stick goes kaput? Of course you wouldn't.
Frankly it's pathetic to even see these silly arguments. It would be as pathetic as me claiming HD DVD was broken because of firmware issues in some Toshiba players. Both standards are complex and it is to be expected that some early models will have issues.
regeya @ Feb 9th 2008 1:06PM
Early adopters of a new format plagued with buggy players, film at 11.
Devils Advocate @ Feb 9th 2008 1:20PM
This is a good thing. I really hope this will serve as a wake up call for Samsung to up the quality on their bluray players.
Killer @ Feb 9th 2008 2:15PM
"Why do you want to buy a BD player when you already have the BEST one? The PS3 is the best player available as the Cell effortlessly decodes the BD movie at lightning quick speeds."
Wrong. The Panasonic BD30K is, get it right. The PS3 is DTS Master-less meaning it's NOT the best, (I don't care if it can be upgraded later), "right now" means right now and right now the PS3 doesn't have DTS Master. I know you want to believe your console is the best Blu-ray player, but it isn't. Till they upgrade it to have DTS Master, tell me, because right now, its only 2nd best. Also I got the BD30K cheaper than the PS3...Hmmmmmm
Getting back to the topic at hand. It will be interesting to see if the other companies come to Samsung's rescue. The last thing BDA needs is Samsung to get screwed over in a lawsuit, and switch sides (Not saying they ever would) there is always a slight possbility though. This isn't an easy fixable suit either, its a class action lawsuit and with 32% of Blu-ray players being samsung on the market this could be a lot of cash.
Mike @ Feb 9th 2008 2:37PM
To JimC and DrXYm:
Ok so Samsung has botched 2 players. What do you do when newer movies have features that aren`t supported by the players that people currently own Oh yea... you do a firmware upgrade... but how. No ethernet connection. You just burn it onto a disc and insert it into the player. Ok so once you are able to update the firmware how do you view any downloadable content that all the studios may eventually employ.
Looks like those very expensive, very obsolete Blu Ray players will need to be replaced with newer players.
This is only one opinion but I would like to know why this is good for the consumer.
I think Sony isn`t in this for the customer, they just have a chip on their shoulder from losing the Beta Max thing. Thay don`t want to lose twice in a format war.
DrXym @ Feb 10th 2008 6:52AM
"What do you do when newer movies have features that aren`t supported by the players that people currently own Oh yea... you do a firmware upgrade... but how. No ethernet connection. You just burn it onto a disc and insert it into the player. Ok so once you are able to update the firmware how do you view any downloadable content that all the studios may eventually employ."
I don't see the point of these arguments. Do you also complain that your USB 1.0 computer doesn't have a firmware upgrade to 2.0? Or that your 802.11b/g wifi doesn't update to 802.11i? Or that your HD DVD 1080i player doesn't upgrade to do 1080p?
You buy based on the features you want and the features the device offers. You don't complain after the fact that certain functionality in a later device or spec will not work on your existing device. Anyway, so-called BD-Live disks will just hide BD-Live features on older players but you still get movie playback and any features that don't require storage / internet connectivity.
You're the only person who can say whether internet or local storage are deal breakers for you. Personally I couldn't care less. I have a computer so why would I care about some silly game leader board, online polls, trailers, or whatever storefront that Sony / Disneys / Warner's shove on the disk? These are very minor features and I doubt anyone would miss them. But of course if you want them you could buy a PS3 right now or wait a few months for whenever 2.0 is due to become mandatory. I own a PS3 so I'll get the features in due course but I think I will disable internet if there is a switch to do. I actually don't want my player phoning home when I watch a disk.
Besides, what is it about the HD DVD disks with web content that has raised your expectations? Very few of them even bother, and those that do have hardly pushed the boat out.
Wes @ Feb 10th 2008 11:22PM
@DrXym
No, I wouldn't be upset that usb 1.0 cannot be firmware upgraded to 2.0. However, that said, I would complain if I bought a pc for $399 dollars and learned a day later that it only had usb 1.0 ports, less features etc.
If the same store was selling one for $149.99 with more features and the sales person directed me to the $399 one, I'd be extra-mad. Probably, feel-like-returning-my-pc mad and demanding a refund.
However, I do understand that others would defend the store saying they are just trying to make money. Its not the consumer's fault. The consumer should have researched the product themselves and became an expert before making a purchase not relying on the salesperson's expertise
qo_op @ Feb 9th 2008 2:39PM
Despite its flaws, its no like its the only Blu Ray player choice manufacturer, unlike HDDVD *cough*Toshiba*cough*
Truth Teller @ Feb 9th 2008 2:42PM
Amazing.
Tumble-weed & howling winds time.
S'funny how we get 100+ posts on threads & the pack of hyenas descend when there's a chance of taking a good bash at HD DVD but suddenly everyone's silent (or making an occasional lame excuse or attempt to divert) when it comes to a Blu-ray problems or issue.
Yeah, so many are really just here to make honest comments & support the consumer's interests.
Hypocrite liars.
Truth Commenter @ Feb 10th 2008 1:55AM
TruthTeller-Dave "Yeah, so many are really just here to make honest comments & support the consumer's interests."
To quote you, but as it applies to you,
"Hypocrite"
DrXym @ Feb 10th 2008 6:56AM
Perhaps you are blind, but people have responded. Besides, this is not a problem with blu ray the standard, just one implementation of it. Perhaps you can apply some idiot logic and proclaim blu ray broken because of one busted player?
Truth Teller @ Feb 11th 2008 7:49AM
@ Glen
Where did I say the recent HD DVD numbers are a "win", now, hmmmmm?
They are undeniably (to anyone in the least bit fair-minded) a noticeable improvement and a clear return from the worst for HD DVD.
The point is even with all the recent terrible publicity etc etc Blu-ray still can't kill off HD DVD.
The point is that HD DVD is still very much in this and the fight is very far from over.
Maybe there's something wrong with your comprehension skills - or is it that you're the delusional one, only seeing what you want to see?
Truth Teller @ Feb 9th 2008 2:46PM
KayRazy Ken Kutaragi
I don't have to take any glasses off, you obviously just decided to ignore the bit where I said "Good for you.
But you are hardly representitive of every PS3 owner."
Then you ask me "Is Toshiba your GOD"?
FFS what are you on, eh?
I have to ask, are you about 5 or something?
qo_op @ Feb 9th 2008 2:57PM
HDDVD has a slew of other problems than just their sub par home HDDVD players. HAha, you found 1 negative article about blu ray, wouldnt shut up about it in every post until it was posted and now you want people to rant along with you and the rest of the monkeys at the HDDVD circus. LOL, my my.
Truth Teller @ Feb 9th 2008 3:05PM
Actually I mentioned this article twice before this article appeared.
Fail.
Truth Commenter @ Feb 10th 2008 1:59AM
TruthTeller-Dave: "Actually I mentioned this article twice before this article appeared."
Nope, credit goes to Nfinity and Prey521.
sm @ Feb 9th 2008 6:20PM
was Microsoft ever sued for selling defective 360s?
Elad @ Feb 10th 2008 12:22PM
HAHAHA. Best post here. More than half of the people I know who own 360s have gotten the red lights. I am one of maybe two people that haven't gotten it yet, and I expect it everyday. My 360 doesn't shut off completely everytime I turn it off and I can hear it running like an hour after I stop using it. The 360 (as much as I love it) is manufactured like a piece of shit. No one will sue them because you have to be crazy to go against MS. This is the most overlooked manufacturing flaw right now. People have recieved systems back that just get the red lights again, and additionally, there is absolutely no compensation offered to gamers who have lost their system for months at a time (not to mention the Live fees they're paying while it is innactive) The Samsung suit is a joke compared to it. And Truth Teller you're a dick. No one even listens to you, why do you post? All you tell are lies and blatent HD DVD biased shit (sorry that was off topic, but it should be mentioned in every post).
mntwister @ Feb 9th 2008 7:25PM
I am surprised that ANYONE bought the bd-up5000 combi player. There has been plenty of documentation of problems with Samsungs, so why would anyone buy one after that? Yet, they do it, and then sue them. LOL. I think Samsung has given a bad name to blu-ray. I had their 1200 player and luckily got to return it before 90 days was up, but never again. I went and bought a PS3 and I couldn't be happier. Not a single disc play problem after over 120 blu-rays including the 1.1 movies. Those who wouldn't buy this because it was a "game machine" as they claimed, are now in court. Stubborn Stubborn.
Bob @ Feb 10th 2008 12:36AM
I've been lucky so far with my new BD-P1400, no problems yet.
HDpurist @ Feb 10th 2008 5:40AM
Theres a bigger lawsuit: moronic HD-DVD shills lead by nfinity and truthteller have sued Warner Bros for going Blu exclusive.
Check it out. LOL
mntwister @ Feb 10th 2008 2:28PM
are you serious? Do you have a link? This is a riot! As if Warner can't make their own choices. If you have a link to see I'd love to see it. I need some good humor today.
hey alex @ Feb 10th 2008 1:52PM
Didn't the BD association state that early adopters knew what they were getting into?
Gives you a nice warm fuzzy when the association for Blu-Ray basically says you should expect a problem with early Blu-Ray players not being compatible with the later specification.
Wes @ Feb 10th 2008 11:29PM
Actually, That's not entirely there. There have been a fair bit of cases of there being some compensation. Gamers on their second RROD who put of a fuss are usually offered free arcade games or games from Microsoft studios.
Truth Teller @ Feb 11th 2008 7:42AM
Jesus H Christ
Glen yours has to be the most ludicrous post I've seen here yet
(and by God there's some competition for that title).
Get back to Blu-ray.com & go stroke yourself with your PS3.
Truth Commenter @ Feb 11th 2008 9:06AM
TruthTeller aka Dave: "Glen yours has to be the most ludicrous post I've seen here yet"
Proof even you don't read what you write.
And watch the language.
Michael @ Mar 20th 2008 2:46PM
"So what're you going to about it, huh? Buy another format? Hah-hah!"