Nielsen VideoScan High-Def market share for week ending November 11th, 2007

by Ben Drawbaugh, posted Nov 16th 2007 at 4:05PM

The comedies strike back this week, as two Universal HD DVD exclusives help the red camp regain a little lost ground, according to this weeks Nielsen VideoScan numbers, courtesy of Home Media Magazine. Disney's Rat and Cars wasn't enough to outsell HD DVD 70/30 again this week, as the number slips to 65/35 (1.86:1). Judging by the fact that Transformers held on strong by staying in the top four for so many weeks and there were three HD DVD titles in the top ten compared to last week's one, it's probably safe to assume that all those extra HD DVD players that hit the streets recently are helping out. With the influx of HD movies players for both sides in the past few weeks, and the release of one of the biggest neutral titles since 300, next week should be an interesting week.

Filed under: Blu-ray, HD DVD

Tags: format war, FormatWar, Nielsen VideoScan, NielsenVideoscan, VideoScan

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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)

Neutral

Kris @ Nov 16th 2007 4:11PM

Ugh, I don't think this format war is ever going to end..

Neutral

david @ Nov 16th 2007 8:28PM

I agree man. I'm sick of it already. I have both (thanks to Wally World's fire sale) but I just want it done.

Low Ranked

mike @ Nov 16th 2007 4:11PM

ratatouliee bah. Why do people buy cartoons in hi-def. They look good enough on dvd up converted that its not worth the extra money to purchase the HD version. I save my HD money for action films with lots of fast scenes and colours. Also, movies with lots of dark scenes. These movies are the ones that deserve HD treatment.

Highest Ranked

elvisizer @ Nov 16th 2007 6:50PM

any movie with good source elements will benefit from HD. pixar movies are some of the BEST looking HD discs out there. basically, you couldn't be more wrong.

Neutral

EddieBrentwood @ Nov 16th 2007 7:39PM

Hi Mike, actually Computer Animation is where HD really shines. It is not my favorite genre of movie but it looks so crisp in HD. Plus, in hi def digest, Ratatouille was the first disc of any format to get a 5 star rating.

"This Blu-ray release is also fantastic, boasting absolutely perfect video and audio, plus a great package of extras. I've reviewed over 500 next-gen discs over the last year and a half, and not one has received a perfect five star rating overall, but there's a first time for everything and I'm happy to report that 'Ratatouille' is it."

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1048/ratatouille.html

Neutral

HDpurist @ Nov 18th 2007 8:24PM

mike, LOL at your FUD. Based on your view point, the Shrek 3 HD-DVD/DVD combo is therefore a completely pointless release. Since it has the DVD version, then there's need for the HD-DVD version!!! Wow, how idiotic can you be?

Neutral

Sean @ Nov 16th 2007 4:13PM

I dont play the numbers game, but I am not surprised about the sales of Cars and Rat.

Neutral

misbarne @ Nov 16th 2007 4:13PM

Who bought Chuck and Larry? That movie sucked on SD and HD

Highest Ranked

Dario @ Nov 16th 2007 4:33PM

@misbarne,

How dare you. Jessica Biel's boobs in hi def is worth any price.

Highest Ranked

TJ @ Nov 16th 2007 4:21PM

Personally, I think ANY movie deserves the HD treatment, as long as the source material holds up. Ratatouille looks incredible on Blu-ray.

Feel free to watch your upconverts, but I only buy Blu-ray and HD DVD now. I think its completely worth it for the extra 5 bucks.

Neutral

EddieBrentwood @ Nov 16th 2007 10:28PM

totally agree with you. and if someone doesnt think it is worth it, I wonder why they would read engadgetHD and not just regular engadget

Low Ranked

Nfinity @ Nov 16th 2007 4:23PM

The real shift in numbers won't be visible until January, but it's becoming pretty obvious that Blu is getting weaker and weaker. With multiple high profile releases, they are unable to make dramatic shifts in numbers as they did before. Pretty much what we expected.

January 2008, the numbers will be looking more in HD DVD favor. The best part, we don't have to wait too much longer. :) And with TL51 a reality, whoohoo, now we're talking business. Blu devastation begins. Btw, you do know that with TL51, the drive speeds goes up to 1.5x effectively increasing HD DVD default bitrates? Tell me you knew that right?

I like me some Blu ass-whoopin for less then half the price!

Highest Ranked

domerdel @ Nov 16th 2007 4:51PM

Nfinity:

I don't see a blu devistation happening, only gains from here on out. The only devastation is the prolonging of the war. Both sides IMO are going to do great next year, but it keeps two business models side by side (you on your side, me on mine) alive.

Question about TL51 (Same as TJ's).. official link would be prefered if anyone has a lead.

Highly Ranked

pedantic @ Nov 16th 2007 5:37PM

@Nfinity

Rather than looking like a delusional fanboy, why don't you actually wait until HD-DVD makes real in-roads into the BD's sales number. BD had another status quo week, outselling HD-DVD at a 1.86:1 ratio. Last week BD had a good title and had 2.45:1 ratio. If you consider that as a "win", then you have to realize that HD-DVD needs to get that ratio below 1.86:1 to cut into the year-to-date number, and 1.56 to make inroads to the since-conception number.

As for TL51, I'm still waiting for official word that all current players will support it. Otherwise, how is that any better than BD and their "non-finalized" standard? Toshiba made such a big deal about how 50GB was overkill, and that 30GB would be enough, then why did they feel they needed to increase the size of a layer from 15GB to 17GB? Wouldn't it be easier to just make each layer 15GB, it strikes me as one-up-manship. Believe what you will, but the red-fanboys are just as bad as the blue-fanboys. Fanboyism is bad.

Neutral

mntwister @ Nov 17th 2007 12:49AM

lol, ok hd-dvd fanboy. No mention that after 90,000 more players, still 65/35. You forgot to mention that dude, lol.

Highly Ranked

TJ @ Nov 16th 2007 4:25PM

Will the current drives read the 51gb discs though?

Neutral

alonzo @ Nov 16th 2007 5:10PM

Unfortunately I think the real devistation will be to the HD DVD folks. Whether folks want to accept it or not...there are alot of people are buying the playstation to watch movies (myself included). Why pay the same price for a stand alone when you can get a game system as well? There is absolutely no way that HD DVD can come close to the number of units that the playstation will sell this holiday. HD DVD software sales are still embarrassing and I just don't see them ever getting close to BD's levels especially as the playstation sells hundreds of thousands this Christmas. I think once HD DVD $99 buyers see the poor selection of movies that are open to them...word of mouth will put the final nail in that coffin.

Neutral

Nfinity @ Nov 16th 2007 5:28PM

whacha talkin about Willis?! WHO IS BUYING PS3?

Go to your local Gamestop and ask them how many PS3s for $399 since they got them? The numbers are PATHETIC. So bad, that Stringer has to come out as say how they doubled the sales. ARE YOU FREAKIN' KIDDING ME. Do you know that $499 discount for 60gb had better sales then this. Sony is in a LOT of trouble. Nobody wants a PS3. Achievements, every single person I know has Xbox 360, Xbox Live, Marketplace etc etc. PS3 not only doesn't have games it doesn't have other stuff too.

By Stringer they doubled their sales from pathetic 75k a month to like 130k a month. LOL! We all know this will last for another couple of weeks and then bam, down like the previous discount in price. PS3 is COMPLETELY unappealing to anyone. Gamers don't want it, movie-loving folks want a standalone and not a game console and it's a lose lose for Sony.

On the other hand HD DVD will see another $99 sale for the player probably selling another 100-200k units, then Xbox 360 add-on for HD DVD is selling LIKE HOTCAKES. Latest news say that XBox 360 add-on outsold ALL Blu-Ray standalone players by something ridiculous like 3:1. And that's only the add-on. You can bet your ass that there will close to a million HD DVD players on the market by year's end. Do you have ANY idea what this means. This means 1 million DEDICATED - for movie playback ONLY - machines. What do you think Warner will do? Their BDA membership expired, they did not renew so they have less interest in Blu-Ray now. I wonder why they didn't renew (hint hint)?

TL51 approval compatible with all players was the final nail in the coffin. Now not only does HD DVD have all features working, the price and backwards compatibilty but now it has a bigger size too and with the 1.5x increase in speed it will most likely match the bitrate (of course this is irrelevant either way because we've seen no real gains with higher bitrate and Blu-Ray anyways, it's just a talking point anyways).

So son, you need to get prepared. Cause after Stringer's announcement that he would so much love to go back in time to negotiate with HD DVD again, Sony selling off CELL manufacturing due to completely abandoning Cell architecture, you can bet your ASS that Blu-Ray's days are numbered.

The only form we will see Blu-Ray from next year will be aka UMD. Playing games for their console. Done.

Highly Ranked

h4ldol @ Nov 16th 2007 5:20PM

Blu-ass whoopin? 65:35 for the week... again. ^5:35 for YTD... again. Greater than 60:40 since inception... again. Doesn't look like much of an ass whoopin' going on there, except the one that HD DVD has been getting since it came out. With cheap @$$ players. And few months head start. Still can't do better than 60:40? Never won a week of sales? Ouch. Can't wait to put my HD DVD player up on ebay... not that I will get more than a few bucks for it I'm sure.

Highest Ranked

andy @ Nov 16th 2007 5:24PM

Does this count Buy One Get One?

If so, wouldn't it be safe to say that HDDVD media is slightly outselling BRD? You can't cut the BRD share in half because some people would buy multiple titles anyway, but knocking 1/3 off the sales of BRD would be reasonable, no?

PS: I'm one of the walmart 99 dollar player guys, and I just bought my first discs yesterday. So, I'm pretty sure it'll be a couple of weeks before the impact of the walmart players shows up.

Neutral

domerdel @ Nov 16th 2007 5:37PM

Nfinity:

proof that TL51 works on "all" existing players? btw, PS3 sales doubled in a week since price drop... not so pathetic.

Neutral

BABYBOY69MP @ Nov 17th 2007 9:54AM

Hey buddy we're talking bout hd dvd and blu ray sales not video games.

Neutral

Iridium @ Nov 19th 2007 1:32PM

Way to be a paid Microsoft attack blogger. Love you guys.

The PS3 is the best selling HD movie player and has sold very well in its first year. Even if only 30% of owners know that it can play BluRay movies, A complete BS number from a idiotic poll. The PS3 might not be selling as well as the Wii but numbers are on track to match or beat the 360's first year. Oh yeah and we know that Microsft inflated thier end of the year numbers by 2-3 million. Thats why it took over 6 months for Microsoft to show any growth when they had already "sold" 10.5 million by January.

I doubt that any of the Toshiba players can be updated with firmware to allow a 3 layer disc to be read. If that was the case then it would be esasy to update a single layer reader to dual layer. Unless Toshiba made the layers thinner to be within the focal range of the laser then it can't happen. However then you would run into a problem reading the current discs. The player would have to detect a 3 layer or 2 layer disc and adjust the focal range. It just isn't going to happen.

The reason why triple layer BluRay discs can work more easily than HD-DVD is the fact that BluRay layers are thinner making it easier for the laser to read the imprints. I'd hate to buy a triple layer HD-DVD and get a little bit of dirt or a small scratch on the disc that would completely throw off the third layer. I'd love to have all of my movies skip terribly.

Highly Ranked

Chaz @ Nov 16th 2007 5:28PM

The tide continues to shift in favor of HD-DVD... there's no way any fanboys can ignore that fact.

As Sony continues to lose money on their third place gaming console, their high-def format continues to lose ground (even with the BOGOF offers). Giving away free movies to pad your numbers, is definately a sign of desperation. They can inflate their stats all they want, but the studios and home movie distribution companies know what's really goin' on...

HD-DVD owners, simply buy more movies than Blu-Ray owners. This attache rate, along with the influx of affordable players, moved Paramount over to the Red side... and we now see it was with good reason. As a higher percentage of consumers adopt high-def media, we see HD-DVD gaining more and more ground. The argument that Blu-fan-boys use is that many people buy PS3's for it's Blu-Ray function, but statistics shoot that down, as only 20% of PS3 owners, actually use it to watch movies. I mean.. how many of us actually bought a Playstation 2 for every room in our house to watch movies in? **crickets chirp** EXACTLY...... :) But people will be buying $99 HD-DVD players for multiple rooms in their home, that's guaranteed!

Any big movie release week for HD-DVD... is a win... first Transformers... next is Shrek 3.

Neutral

elvisizer @ Nov 16th 2007 7:07PM

i didn't know hddvd players came with brief cases. that must account for their higher 'attache' rate! LOfreakin'L!

Neutral

Chaz @ Nov 16th 2007 5:36PM

And for you idiots who can't see that the BDA is padding their numbers with their BOGOF desperation; then you're just ignoring the facts that are right in front of your face.

Any week they have bogof, divide their nielsen numbers by two, or even 1.5 ( to be nice )... and that shows that HD-DVD clearly had a better week.

Universal smells blood, and is starting to release their movies WAY sooner than ever (The Kingdom is coming out in December, as is Hearbreak Kid).

It will be real interesting to see how Ocean's 13 and the Harry Potter movies will do on both formats.

Highly Ranked

andy @ Nov 16th 2007 5:44PM

@ Chaz

Just regarding your Ocean's 13 and HP comment:

I am a fan of art and storytelling. I bought Ocean's 13 yesterday on HDDVD. I have the SD version of every HP movie, and will be buying the HDDVD set on December 11.

It's anecdotal at best, but I doubt that I'm alone.

Neutral

elvisizer @ Nov 16th 2007 7:03PM

yeah, a better week in imaginary land. Bogo's count. deal with it.

Neutral

Nfinity @ Nov 16th 2007 6:34PM

Sure

40th DVD Forum Meeting where TL51 is officially approved and as a member DATARIUS a company involved with testing approved the results. On this meeting not only that TL51 was approved but there were several other notable things too. Chinese HD DVD got approvals for logo and ssome additional finalized info and approval of HD DVD recorders and HD DVD-RW disc specification. Note that 51G disc specification is Version 2.0 which was under testing.

Again, Datarius gives their approval too, on technical aspects as well as replication and yield results.

http://www.dvdforum.org/40scmtg-resolution.htm

This was already known during Blu-Ray in Sept. but TL51 was under strict NDA.
http://www.datarius.com/news/news-HTML/Blue-days-sept-2007.htm

If you are unclear what the results mean, join the AVS Forum discussion on the 40th DVD Forum meeting here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=939385&page=2

Highly Ranked

Truth Teller @ Nov 16th 2007 5:42PM

Wow, so this is the best Blu-ray can manage with a 'buy-one-get-one-free' offer going on & boosted with supposed blockbusters like Spiderman 3 (which was/is a really cr@ppy movie btw) and Ratatouille.

Oh dear.

I can't wait to see what happens in a few weeks when all those new HD DVD owners have done with their freebie movies and start buying new ones.

Shame Videoscan prefers to leave Walmart & Amazon sales numbers out (only the 2 largest retailers on the planet so obviously no big deal. lol).

Highest Ranked

Ben @ Nov 16th 2007 7:16PM

The BOGOF offer isn't included in these numbers. It didn't start until 11/11/07.

Also Amazon is included in this, but not Wal-mart.

Highly Ranked

MI @ Nov 16th 2007 5:48PM

Hi Chaz, lovely to hear words of wisdom as always. Not allowed on the AVS Forums any more I see?

Didn't all the HDVD folks say last week when the scores were still way in favor of BD, that the effect of the $99 Toshiba clearance sale wouldn't be seen till this week, and then...Boy watch out. Now here we are at this week, and BD's numbers are still consistently out pacing HDVD and so you people are saying 'the real numbers won't be in till January'. Yawn. What's going to save them then? Paramount's buy out didn't do it, Transformers didn't do it, $200 HDVD didn't do it, the big $99 clearance sale didn't do it. What card do they have left to play!?!?

Neutral

Anthony @ Nov 16th 2007 5:51PM

I work for one of the large electronics chains and I have to tell you guys that BR is way more popular than the HDDVD. We had such overstock of the Toshibas that the sale we had we hoped would get rid of some of that and it did but it's true people aren't too happy when they see the movie selection and find out Disney is strictly Blu Ray. We sell way more BR discs than HD DVD's and though the PS isn't as popular as WII and 360 it has been growing and we sell way more of those than the HD DVD players. I know alot of our sales reps recommend the PS for it's BR/gaming capabilities and judging by the number of BR discs we sell ...it's obvious people are using their PS's for movies.

Highly Ranked

smee @ Nov 17th 2007 1:49AM

@Anthony
Yeah, anyone can make up one of those stories.
I work at bla bla, and we only sell HD DVDs, no body wants PS3. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Highly Ranked

DepecheSA @ Nov 16th 2007 6:00PM

Bluray continues to outsell HD DVD... no surprise...

Neutral

andy @ Nov 16th 2007 6:04PM

@ Anthony

The nugget there in your comments is that HDDVD really needs some kids movies to "win" as in being THE format.

I got one of the walmart players and after looking through the available titles, I couldn't agree more. HDDVD really needs some solid cartoons to go mainstream. The grown up movies that I like are more than sufficient (Bourne, Oceans movies), etc., but there is a general lack of little kids movies.

They need a more rounded library.

Neutral

MD @ Nov 16th 2007 7:14PM

I buy Disney movies on SD, & play them on my A2 up converted.
I don't watch them, my kids do, and they love them, they watch them over and over again. They would love them on VHS or beta for that matter. I agree I think HD DVD has more mature movies, but as it is me buying them, I am OK with that.
My kids cant tell the difference when I play an HD movie, and could not care less about there one's being SD, so our family has the best of both worlds.

Neutral

andy @ Nov 16th 2007 6:08PM

After accounting for BOGO and assuming all movies sold cost the same amount:

Blu-ray has a 48% share in the revenue for last week.

I don't think either side is "winning" when the revenue is essentially 50/50.

Highly Ranked

Mike @ Nov 16th 2007 6:36PM

Ratatouille looks beautiful on Blu but the load times are incredibly long. I don't think that's very consumer friendly. Trying to navigate the disc is frustratingly slow. I have both but I'm still leaning red even more now.

Highly Ranked

EddieBrentwood @ Nov 16th 2007 7:55PM

thats interesting, I commented earlier that Ratatouille got the best rating of any hi def disc ever and it made me want to buy it just to see its features.

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1048/ratatouille.html

I have a similar feeling for my V for Vendetta HDDVD(Japanese Version) so I am hoping transformers will be better when I pick it up. its not out here in Japan yet :(

Neutral

elvisizer @ Nov 16th 2007 7:01PM

@ mike- strange that you'd mention that- ratatouille still loads to menu faster than my xa2 boots to the first screen. I'm guessing you have something other than a PS3 for your blu ray player.
i definitely will be purchasing any dual format releases on blu instead of hddvd since i've never had a playback problem with a blu ray disc on the PS3, and i've had a few here and there with the xa2. nothing major, but the ps3 has been a freaking rock of stability for me, and it's quieter than the xa2 as well.

Neutral

EddieBrentwood @ Nov 16th 2007 7:59PM

yeah, I have had a better experience with my ps3 than with my A20 so far. I do hear that the some Sony standalones BD players are noisy and slow too. my A20 is not too noisy(thats my 360) but it is very slow and not at all responsive. but it was 230 bucks so didnt pay a fortune for it.

Neutral

jason @ Nov 16th 2007 7:02PM

Ben, is it possible to get some numbers for movies that were released on both formats? I think seeing how the same title sells on both formats would be far more revealing. For example, "300" on blu-ray is number nine on the chart above so I wonder how many copies the HD DVD version sold?

Neutral

elvisizer @ Nov 16th 2007 7:05PM

why the hell doesn't anyone in this thread know how to spell the word devastation? yeesh.

Neutral

GoBD @ Nov 16th 2007 7:34PM

LOL, you HD-DVD fan boys need to seek medical help because you seriously have problems with delusional fantasies!

LMAO at some of those comments. A $99 HD-DVD player for every room? Just shows what cheap tat you fill your home with. A player to go with every $100 HD TV I suppose?

The media sales speaks for itself and BluRay has dominated HD-DVD week in, week out! Transformers was the only HD-DVD exclusive heavyweight which was the so-called BluRay killer (for all that was worth!) and it unfortunately didn't have enough punch to overtake BluRay for even one week! Your excuse is that the Videoscan numbers are wrong! Well you can delude yourself with that fact of course.

Even the fire sale of cheap Tosh players didn't make much, if ANY impact on media sales including number padding all the free discs that Toshiba have to bribe people with and worth more than the player itself!! Now what does that tell you?

Sorry, you'll have to find a new angle to rant about because there are no facts to support the none existent devastation! Toshiba can't, and never have, held any weight against the top electronic manufacturers which are so much better producing top quality products. They should go back to making washing machines! They were good at those. Oh, I almost forgot there are those other miscellaneous Asian brands that no-one has heard of bringing out some more cheap as chips players which will no doubt come free with boxes of breakfast cereal. LMAO!

PS3 sales continue to GROW and even with the so called low attachment rates which incidentily were numbers released by the HD-DVD Promotional Group who also "coincidentily" declined to comment on what hardware numbers they based their calculations on!!! Scared of the fact that BluRay devices are out there in far greater numbers than HD-DVD? I think so.

No amount of freebies is going to change the fact that HD-DVD is only being purchased in any numbers by fan boys who haunt forums flaming Bluray and obviously seem to be stockpiling them in their own homes!

BluRay is dominating in the US, dominating in Europe, and dominating in Asia!!

There is your devastation! =)

Neutral

Chris Frost @ Nov 17th 2007 2:23PM

That's incorrect. Hot Fuzz on HD DVD beat Pixar's Rat to the 5 star punch, which was also reviewed on High Def Digest. Apparently their review crew suffers from short term memory loss.

http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/880/hotfuzz.html

Neutral

sean @ Nov 16th 2007 7:44PM

jason, try http://www.eproductwars.com/dvd/
it shows real time stats of saleranks for items sold on amazon and is close enough to what you want to know. Pick a disk and look at the salesranks to see how its doing in relation to other standard def media and high def media being sold.
unfortunately right now planet earth seems to be the only dual format release showing up in the top 10. although it can be hard to compare 2 releases side by side on that site as I've seem major fluctuations on a day to day basis.

Neutral

ryan @ Nov 16th 2007 10:45PM

I would say gaining ground on the week when blu thought they would crush hd because of rat and cars is quite the achievement. Think how close the sales would have been without rat. Think how much better the sales would have been if red had a huge title like your rat.

65:35 is a loss but it shows a gain in momentum.

Neutral

Nfinity @ Nov 16th 2007 10:47PM

Not only that.. which is laughable at BEST.. they are still living in denial despite the fact that Stringer himself makes statements like "I would like to go back in time to make piece with HD DVD" and "We really need to concentrate on PS3 as a gaming console" etc etc.. not to mention only 1 Profile 1.1 player that's next to impossible to find even if you want to pay $500 for it with only bare functionality (not to mention only core audio decode where you have to buy an additional receiver to decode true TrueHD and DTS-MA).

By January, the massacre over Blu-ray will be even more pronounced. The software advantage will kick in and that whole idiotic argument will be put to rest, just like the 50gb size which now HD DVD finally has squared away, most places will be selling $150 A3s at MSRP with at least a million HD DVD players already on the market, Warner will drop Blu-ray to go HD DVD exclusive (all the smurfs know this, they are just hoping it ain't true) and it's not excluded that at that time you will see possibly some CE companies announcing HD DVD only players in the $300-$400 range.

They are all free to archive this statement and re-read it in late January.

Neutral

h4ldol @ Nov 16th 2007 10:49PM

Amusing, those HD DVD fanboys. I would tone it down if my format of choice has lost every week of sales since the format war began, and by a significant and frankly embarrassing margin at that. How about waiting until HD DVD can actually win a week of sales? Just one.

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