Universal Studios VP sez HD DVD is 'more affordable' than Blu-ray
As if the format war really needed another quote for fanboys on both sides to jump on and argue over, none other than Ken Graffeo (an executive vice president at Universal Studios) threw a proverbial can of lighter fluid right on the fire. Responding to the recent Target reports that misinterpreted Sony's purchase of an "end cap" for Blu-ray players as the ousting of HD DVD from the store, Ken went on to say that "standalone HD DVD players are still much more affordable than Blu-ray players," and moreover, he reportedly added that HD DVD provided a better experience, and welcomed a direct comparison between movies such as 300 and Blood Diamond, which are available on both formats. 'Course, there certainly seems to have been a lot more price cutting going on in the HD DVD camp of late, but regardless of price quarrels, what does this say about Universal's chances of actually supporting Blu-ray anytime soon?
Filed under: Industry, Blu-ray, HD DVD, Players, Universal-HD
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
SimbaDogg @ Jul 30th 2007 7:56PM
but for the time being, hd-dvd is definitely the no brainer when it comes to affordability, but as far as who's actually selling more, thats a whole 'nother story. And to say that one format is better than another because of "an additional experience", i'd have to say he may want to retract that statement, and then decide if he wants to say that after october (finalized spec). Because other than that, it seems that paramount has proven that blu ray does have a slight edge in one important aspect, available bytes.
http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=360 (this should be up on engadget hd sometime soon, i dropped off the tip a day or so ago)
Paul Arnette @ Jul 30th 2007 8:11PM
Considering you can only view 3/7 of the major studios movies on HD DVD currently, shouldn't it be cheaper? :p
Paul Arnette @ Jul 30th 2007 8:13PM
In HD of course.
Tom @ Aug 1st 2007 7:34AM
Blu-ray keeps stating it has more studios which falsly is implying that it has more content available to consumers.
The truth and fact of the matter is that both formats have been on the market for over a year now and HD DVD has more content released and available for purchase then Blu-ray!
Totals of Format Titles Released in North America
HD DVD: 291
Blu-ray: 284
Plus HD DVD has many exclusive adult titles and since titles released anywhere in the world can be purchased and played here in North America they should also be included in the count of what is available to North America consumers....
Engadget has some missing titles in there release count of both formats. I have sent an message offering to show the missing items but have not received any response as of yet.
Engaget is great and seems to be fair on reporting things about the format war so I dont think this is on purpose. If anyone from engadgethd reads this, please contact me so that the published statistics might be corrected for your readers.
Mr. E @ Jul 30th 2007 8:18PM
Cheaper hardware is in no way going to win this war for HD DVD, it's just stretching out the format war unnecessarily and encouraging people to buy into a dead-end format. With effectively only a single hardware manufacturer currently (Toshiba) and a single exclusive studio (Universal), not to mention the pasting the format is taking on software sales, I wouldn't buy the hardware at any price at this point.
Besides, why obsess about a price advantage on hardware when the truly expensive part of getting into next-gen DVD is the software? I mean, they keep pressing the point that HD DVD discs have lower manufacturing costs. You'd never know it when Paramount announces Star Trek:TOS on HD DVD with an MSRP of $217.99--for ONE season! Source: http://www.startrek.com/startrek/view/store/news/article/2303263.html
I was very close to getting into HD DVD via the XBox360 add-on drive, until I saw which way the wind was blowing.
No matter how much water they bail, Toshiba and Universal won't be able to keep the HD DVD boat afloat for much longer.
Serengeti @ Aug 1st 2007 9:15AM
Not to nitpick, here, but while I generally disagree with you that HDDVD is a "dead format", I need to point out that if you buy HDDVD's, they're in no way going to be useless once the format "dies".
The media are the same size, can be read by generally the same hardware, and vary greatest in the software required to read them. It's not a "dead format", by any means.
Nfinity @ Jul 30th 2007 8:44PM
I'm going to restrain from posting any further comments on Engadget after this one, when SimbaDogg and likes mouth off completely ridiculous information.
I'm just going to wait until "the dead format" gets Walmart support, $99 chinese players and $150 Toshiba higher quality HD DVD players, most likely by Christmas and you see all the studios starting to release more and more movies with richer content, combo discs, cheaper prices. Oh, wait, studios are ALREADY releasing more interesting content on HD DVD. Let's just see how well 300 sells shell we.
Then, you see Fox and Disney "suddenly" decide that it's not such a bad idea to start releasing their content on "other formats". Let me remind you that Disney already started doing that with XBox Live. And by end of year, we hear an announcement that Denon, LG , Samsung decided it's not such a bad idea to release HD DVD players only too.
It's completely ridiculous to say that Blu-Ray sales are going better? Where exactly did you get that information. The ONLY thing that gives BOOST to Blu-Ray in numbers IS in fact PS3. What standalone sales are you talking about. But let's not go into this.
You smartasses forget that PS3 STARTED selling because it was AFFORDABLE in terms of value, even WITHOUT any movie and titles. People who were buying PS3s and still buy them, do it because of perceieved VALUE not because of technical superiority or whatever you are saying. What exactly could you PLAY or watch begnning of the year on PS3? NOTHING, yet people bought them including me because of the PRICE being AFFORDABLE for this gaming and hi-def machine that offers hdd and wi-fi etc etc.
So you are completely contradicting your opinions.
This WAR will be decided EXCLUSIVELY by price. Let's just see when HD DVD hits $150, who will LOOK at PS3 or any other stand-alone player on Blu-Ray. There's ENOUGH titles for people to accept a bit of SACRIFICE but to save money. You are truly delusional if you think otherwise.
Doc @ Jul 30th 2007 9:00PM
nfinity...is right..although i feel that china is a key here as well, since they have more consumers then most regions out there alone. Plus isn't it about making money?? if there is a market to make more don't you think that studios' are going to smell the money and try and double their profits? Unless your a studio owned by sony which makes 3..there is a mound of cash to collect since they do have an installed base of "movie" watchers that would love to buy more content. Plus for a format that is "dead" why is it that the total number of titles is almost dead(no pun intended) even?
SimbaDogg @ Jul 31st 2007 12:57AM
@nfinity
i think the only thing that we'l ever agree on, is to disagree, with that said: i think one of the reasons that myself, and a few others are so turned off by your responses is your fanboyism for hd dvd, you're self proclaimed ability to predict the future, and your inability to admit to the blatently obvious.
Sure its great to say that price will ultimately decide the format war, and yes, you are correct, cheap chinese manufactuers getting into the game will definitely have a huge impact, as will walmart. but to say "wait and see when the chinese do it", or "just wait till walmart starts making a big push for hd dvd (i personally think they'd make a bigger push w/ blu ray, just for the simple fact that they have a lot more family oriented movies, and will continue to have more because of 1 studio...disney)...its nothing more than heresay. No one knows who's going to come out on top, and no one can predict the future.
the one thing that we can do is 1) look @ current trends and 2) look @ some of the hard facts. One thing that we can say for sure is it HAS NOT been price so far that has put hd dvd where it is, and blu ray where they are, its been a combination of other things.You say BDA is wasting their money on endcaps and advertising...but sadly, thats helped them. You say the ps3 is the contridictory of the arguement some have made earlier (about price). Maybe it is. But the trojan horse is still selling like hot cakes, and there are quite a few people that are still spendingtwice as much on that then its hd-a2 competition and some of those people are even planning to play games on it.
and to correct you on yet another thing...sony is not BLEEDING any money on these endcaps. yeah
their spending a good amount, but its actually netting them some success...hardly the definition of bleeding, also considering their company doubled their 1st quarter profits, and the only part of their company that lost money was the ps3 portion of their gaming division...most would say they're doing pretty goood.
by the way, the xbox premium is still selling @ 399 (please dont say its going for 350 RIGHT NOW, its not) and please dont say say the ps3 is going for 600...thats just a blatent mistatement of fact. this is supposed to be a no spin zone.
@undawater
couldn't agree with you fully. yes price makes a big difference, but people want content. seeing that they can't get any spiderman movie, disney movie, or any of the other movies made by the other big studios is a bit of a setback. look at movies that have been released on both formats such as the the prestige. just about every movie that has been, and look it up if you want to, has sold
significantly better on blu ray. that is a huge trend, and big dollar studios notice big dollar trends
@mb
hd dvds healths does conincide a lot with the ability to get a studio like disney over. think about how many kids, or grownups for that fact are growing up/have grown up watching the same disney movie over and over and over again. i can't begin to tell you how many disney movies my parents bought for myself and my siblings growing up with disney inking this deal w/ xboxlive...i'm not sure how much of a possibility it still may be.
Vedder @ Jul 30th 2007 9:02PM
I agree with what your saying Nfinity. Price is gonna win this. J6P, heck let alone me, are not in a hurry to purchase a $500.00 Blu-Ray standalone.
I've had HD-DVD player for some time now and with some current releases coming out of the ray camp, I quickly checked the prices of current players on Amazon and was turned off by the prices. While I can easily afford buying one, I'll simply hold off until the prices drop or simply buy the dual format that Samsung will soon be offering.
Nfinity @ Jul 30th 2007 9:17PM
Exactly Vedder. This is exactly what other people are doing. They say exactly what you say, "oh you know what, I'll just wait until there's a combo player that is cheap enough", but guess what, once the price of HD DVD comes down to $150 or lower, you will say "well screw it, it's pretty affordable, why don't I just guy that $100-$150 HD DVD player and start enjoying it, and when combo comes down in price I'll replace it". This is completely valid way of thinking for someone who doesn't want to shell out $500+ for a movie player.
Let's say that market gets overwhelmed with combo players. Anyone who bought a cheap HD DVD player and HD DVD movies will not lose. They'll use their existing cheap HD DVD for bedroom or office or whatever and use their existing HD DVD collection on that combo player. So in reality you will not lose. But if everyone takes this logic and goes for a cheapo HD DVD player, then we don't need a combo player now don't we, cause everyone will see that there's no real point in releasing on Blu-Ray anymore.
I'll tell you how this war will end. It will be either HD DVD winning or combo players will start appearing that will play both. There's absolutely NO CHANCE in hell that Blu-Ray will win straight.
If you told me, with marketing that Sony and BDA has now, and if they had $299 and $250 players, I would without hesitation say, well Blu-Ray will win. But there's no way of this happening as BDA and Sony are already BLEEDING money with all these end caps, PR buyoffs etc etc.
Just watch, how smart HD DVD Group played this game. They were pretty silent, didn't spend money as they saw that people are actually accepting the format, and they just targeted lowering prices to the MAX. Now they are pooring money into advertising. Just look at Best Buy and other big chains and end caps that HD DVD Group is buying. Second half of this year will BELONG to HD DVD. You will see it everyone. Just watch.
Vidikron @ Jul 31st 2007 3:30PM
Man, you're big time fanboy. All these claims of buy offs and such. Why do you care so much who wins? Anyway, you seem to be assuming that the prices of BR players are going to remain stagnant. Why? You really think we'll see $99 HD-DVD players with BR player prices remaining where they are? You're delusional.
Alex @ Jul 30th 2007 9:35PM
they're both bleeding money, and Sony absolutely has to get BluRay/PS3 to catch on for their long term health. Toshiba, not so much. It is a war of attrition, regardless of the specifics.
$$ losses, studios, standalone prices, consumers, it doesn't truly matter short term. If both the big two (sony/toshiba) keep sticking it out the only way this is resolved is either $200 combo players or a couple studios from the BD camp caving. Currently even if Universal does both formats, HD DVD will be around for many years. BluRay would have no reason to fold even if they can't get standalone players to catch on, they might just lose studio support and that is unlikely.
undawater @ Jul 30th 2007 9:55PM
"This WAR will be decided EXCLUSIVELY by price."
Couldn't disagree more. We're already in the land of sub $500 for both. Sub $400 for both by Xmas. At that point, people are going to look at content. What good is a player that doesn't have the movies you want? I think what's missing in this analysis is the assumption that Sony wouldn't respond should it become apparent that price is the motivating factor (which by the way, I don't think it is). They'd adjust their prices, or at the very least throw enough free movies into the mix to negate the difference. But, as long as they're selling more software (be it for PS3s, computers or stand-alone players), they win. The only good thing about this format war is the falling hardware prices, but come 2008 it's time to put one format out to pasture. Retailers have only so much shelf space and as libraries grow, they're not going to support 2 formats. My money's on blu.
Andrew @ Jul 30th 2007 10:03PM
I totally agree with you Nfinity...price matters ;-)
A 99$-150$ HD DVD player on black friday will sell like hot cakes.
mb @ Jul 30th 2007 10:25PM
Fundamentally, you guys are correct in that price is the discerning factor for consumers. If HDDVD (essentially Toshiba and Universal) continue to cut prices on their hardware lineups, HDDVD will look the most attractive to potential buyers.
But. what if the majority of movies are still released on Blu-ray? Yes, Universal is Toshibas greatest ally at the moment (the Weinstein Company is *NOT* a factor), but what HDDVD needs is for Disney to start producing in their format. Warner Bros and Paramount are already doing dual production, but Disney would give HDDVD the largest catalog that is currently unavailable to them now.
Then Blu-ray could be hurting. But until Disney does so, HDDVD will only suffer a slow death. Consumers will ultimately buy the platform that has the most movie choices (especially with kids movies), and that is the sole thing that HDDVD must conquer to survive.
Cheap hardware prices mean nothing if all the movies you want to watch are on the other platform. If Sony & company drop their hardware prices remotely close to HDDVD, then the game is over.
Disclaimer: I own a PS3 and surely miss a lot of Universal movies. But the large blu-ray catalog more than makes up for it (that is, if they ever release anything soon).
Nfinity @ Jul 30th 2007 11:24PM
mb, you seem like a reasonable person and not just another fanboy, so I'll go into discussion with you.
Sure, the titles have some value, however it is not that much. Let me explain why. I have Blu-Ray, HD DVD, pretty much everything. The amount of titles on both sides are pretty small. 265 vs 270 or whatever makes pretty much around 300-350 titles on hi-def available for both formats. If we look at charts that Engadget have shown, for Blu-Ray camp we really have Sony Pictures, Warner and Paramount releasing movies. Others are still on the border right? I mean it's quite normal. Fox being the DRM freaks as they are have been waiting for BD+ to be concluded, so did Disney, they haven't released really any titles but I will tell you, it's not far fetched to say that they've been really looking for excuse not to release, because they wanted to see how Warner titles for example will sell. I can even so far and to assume (I know I know when I assume I make an ass out of you and me :) ), but being in entertainment industry and knowing how these guys think, I would say that Disney and Fox releasing this small amount of titles, have just done even this to respect the contract they have with Sony and BDA in general.
Let's not fool ourselves here Warner is KILLING in sales. Selling on both formats is making them a CRAP load of money right now, even from the small hi-def player base and other Blu-Ray exclusive studios are watching and are getting nervous. Universal might be getting itchy too but I am pretty sure that they are in much better position then Sony Pictures or other studios that made Blu-Ray exclusive decision. Universal STILL holds 60% sales for HD DVD and they like it that way, just like Sony Pictures.
For example, you should see my collection of hi-def movies, Warner holds more then 50% of my shelf space. Don't forget, even though it might seem like it now, Sony Pictures doesn't have as diverse catalog as Universal or even Warner. They may have CURRENT and last years blockbusters, but that's just temporary. What will happen when this year and next year blockbusters start appearing from other studios, let's say Universal or Warner, both HD DVD and Blu-Ray will have access to Warner and Blu-Ray only crowd won't have Universal titles just like HD DVD only crowd doesn't have Sony Pictures titles here.
The reason why I'm pointing this out to you is that titles AT THIS moment are really not THAT important. Studios are still hesitating, waiting, not all movies are out, BUT it's important to note and this is why BDA is getting nervous is that neutral studios are releasing much more content rich titles on HD DVD as opposed to Blu-Ray. BD+ getting in effect October is not really helping BDA as well. This means that NONE of the studios will be releasing movies on Blu-Ray in full glory if they release them AT ALL.
Just look how Disney is getting nervous. They have signed an agreement with Microsoft to rent movies on XBox Live. This was VERY interesting for the whole format war, why..I'll tell you..
Let's say that I don't have anything right now. No console, no hi-def player which is actually a majority of people. Having MANY studios and movies on XBox Live including Disney, I would be more inclined to buy an Xbox 360 over PS3 because of this beautiful thing called XBox Live. So automatically, at $349 a regular person will buy an XBox 360 over $599 PS3 for holidays and on top of that, the more XBox 360 base increases the better the HD DVD addon for it will sell.
Just look at what Microsoft has done:
Xbox 360 Premium ($349) + HD DVD addon ($179) + XBox Live with all movies and games and multiplayer ($50 a year) = $578 < $599. It doesn't matter that PS3 will give WiFi or harder hard drive, with all this, a consumer can get all these XBox 360 hot titles and the full experience for LESS then PS3. This is the key and Disney sees this. They simply LOVE XBox Live. It has proven to be DRM safe service, people are using it actively and Disney wants to see how many people will actually use this. If it turns out positive as I'm pretty sure it will they will start looking at HD DVD add-on crowd.
But all this is IRRELEVANT because the crowd is determining where content goes and not the other way around. Do you think that Disney would go XBox Live if it wasn't like that? So this is why I'm saying, the price is the KEY.
More standalone players, cheap price will dictate what content goes where. It might seem that content right now is crucial factor for people to make a decision which way to go, but it has NEVER been the case in the past and it will definitely not change now. Price is king, and that's that.
will @ Jul 30th 2007 10:26PM
and hd dvd players aswell as blu ray players will be top sellers this holiday season. andrew i agree the day after thanksgiving if hd dvd players are below 200 dollars its a wrap the lowest blu ray players might get is 350 either way their both gonna sale along with the movies. put it like this around the holiday season its going to be hard to purchase a hd dvd player and a blu ray player because their both gonna sale.hd dvd might pick up another studio not this year but am predicting early 2008 and i could be wrong.
T-bone @ Jul 30th 2007 10:34PM
I think it is a tricky way to put in a bias....without without regard. :)
Eric Welch @ Jul 31st 2007 2:48AM
You can argue that Disney is somehow giving support to HD-DVD by selling HD movies on the XBOX Live service, but seems to me this is their opportunity to sell their movies to people who have obviously already chosen to go HD-DVD. You won't see them selling HD-DVD movies directly unless Blu-ray dies. And that'snot likely for some time. Steve Jobs is the single biggest stockholder at Disney and Apple has chosen to support Blu-Ray. Though for content creation with FinalCut Studio which is able to author both formats, their choice so far is mainly pointed at Blu-ray.
You can belive that price is the only factor, but I think you'll find that's not necessarily going to be true. Nobody knows until it happens or not. And some magical $150 price point is nonsense. That may work for you, but what makes you think the rest of the world thinks like you?
Exclusive studios are eventaully going to panic and go to the other side eventually that's going to top the scale. If Universal realizes they are going to be hurt, they are going to go to the other format. Sony, which is much more invested in Blu-ray than Universal is in HD-DVD, it's going to take significantly more pain to make them drop Blu-ray and to with HD-DVD. And then there are other exclusive studios on Blu-ray. There aren't any more exclusive studios in HD-DVD. Universal folds, game over.
I'm just saying. Any claims of knowing the future puts a person on the level of Witch Doctors throwing chicken bones and checking entrails for portents of the future.
domerdel @ Jul 31st 2007 11:16AM
about your xbox 360 price breakdown vs. PS3... here's where that fails... you have to buy all those separately... they all come out of the box with the PS3, no extra purchase, no extra add-ons required.
Bungle @ Jul 31st 2007 4:28PM
You factored in the not-yet-official Xbox 360 price cut but not the existing PS3 price cut? Someone's a little biased. $578 > $499.
Segarsj @ Jul 31st 2007 4:53PM
Next summer's blockbusters...
The Dark Knight (Warner)
Indiana Jones IV (Paramount)
Iron Man (Paramount)
These titles should drive sales quite a bit, and the fact that are backing both formats should further the point that dual format support, at least for the time being, is where it's at.
Rick @ Jul 31st 2007 8:17PM
".... It might seem that content right now is crucial factor for people to make a decision which way to go, but it has NEVER been the case in the past and it will definitely not change now. Price is king, and that's that."
Hmmm, Why did VHS win over Beta?
I'm a general contractor in NY and out of the 20 custom homes I've done in the past few years NOT one has gone the HD DVD way in their media rooms. The home owner always asks for Blu-Ray.
other will @ Jul 30th 2007 11:32PM
For the length of time this has been going on, does anyone else think it likely that combo players will be extremely common in the near future? I mean, I was scared when DVD+R meant that I might not be able to use it on other machines, but has anyone worried about that for years now? I figure that come 1 or 2 years from now, it will be so easy to produce a drive that reads both HD and Blu that none of us really have to worry what we choose now. too optimistic? It would just make things a lot simpler
Christian @ Jul 31st 2007 12:21AM
Just here to point out that nfinity has posted two times too many.
Alex @ Jul 31st 2007 12:27AM
the only way HD players are gonna be selling like proverbial hotcakes on Black Friday is if LCDs are going for rock bottom prices again. CC, Best Buy, and many companies got crushed trying to keep up with WalMart last year so I don't know if it will happen again. If it does and there are HD players below $200, we all win.
Informed Consumer @ Jul 31st 2007 1:32AM
Cost is KEY then? Well by Amazon's average prices for Bluray versus HD-DVD, you'll save $5.60 per catalog title with Bluray ($27.20 Bluray versus $32.80 for HD-DVD). In a 50 disc collection you've saved $280.
http://www.eproductwars.com/dvd/
Thanks for taking 2 pages of crap to say how important cost is and miss the obvious. It's far too complex of an issue for one item to rule. Maybe some of you have what it takes to be Universal Execs too, especially now that the president is hiding from the media after his cheap leisure-suit pitch last year at CEDIA proved totally absurd. Next year this VP will likely be in hiding too, while another covers with something like "We were quietly hedging our bets and were ready to go Blu-ray all along ... we were the only major studio left to hold out and the industry basically forced our hand."
mb @ Jul 31st 2007 1:33AM
I was about to respond to Nfinity, because I thought he brought up a few great points. But I'm getting the feeling that this discussion isn't very popular. Oh well.
I don't think that XBox Live will change the way that people rent/buy videos, but it will put revenue into Microsoft's pocket. It will have no impact on the format war, however.
Whichever side has the most studios behind it wins. People want to watch movies easily. That's all that matters.
mike @ Jul 31st 2007 2:01AM
I too agree its about price. I myself am waiting for this holiday season to pick up a player for $150 (hopefully xbox drive for $100).
For those who think its the movies/content that win the war, im sorry but your wrong. The average consumer (who does win the war) Does not know whats out on side a or b. They just look at the shelf, and see popular movies on both formats. They assume they are the same (content wise). So once the price becomes $150 or less and the mass market adopts, they wont be able to tell if side a or b has the better content.
Also, Blu-ray has like what, FIVE more movies realeased out of 250+ then hd-dvd. Thatd rediculose to call blu-ray a better content machine. And as a matter of fact, blu-ray is region coded while hd-dvd is not. So there are many more titles I can snatch for hd-dvd, and this number will only grow further with more european releases.
I think Region free is the #2 reason I like HD-DVD so much (#1 being cheaper price). In the dvd gerneration, I often get very upset when I see movies not released in region 1, but other regions, or better quality transfers for a different region release. Tat means im screwed. Sure I can buy a region free PAl player, but how do I convince everyone i know who has no idea what a region code is to purchase one of these players? My friends always want to burrow my movies, and I take them to people houses. With HD-dvd Im excited about the region free aspect of it because I can buy an unreleased or better trasnfer from overseas, and watch it on anybodys player or lend iit to anybody.
The only way im going to adopt blu-ray over hd-dvd is if it reached $150 for a stand alone player before hd-dvd. But from what I gather, thats not going to happen. Thus Im choosing Hd-DVD in my verbal war on which format i support.
Bryan @ Jul 31st 2007 9:55AM
One question, do children care about HD? My neices and nephews don't care whether the are watching Disney movies on VHS or DVD, I don't think this war is going to be decided by five year olds.
Andyparhelia @ Jul 31st 2007 5:05AM
Well, I'm not taking sides yet! But I've been following these Videoscan figure's for some time now an blu-ray is definitely in the lead.
Nielsen/VideoScan Numbers ending July 22nd
http://www.nxtbook.com/nxtbooks/questex/hom072907/index.php
Total Hi-Def sale's for last week: Blu-Ray-74% HD-Dvd-26%
Year To Date: Blu-Ray-67% HD-Dvd-33%
Since Inception: Blu-Ray-60% HD-Dvd-40%
Blu ray is gaining a serious advantage at the moment and the PS3 seems to be driving this. Worldwide, 6 million ps3's have been sold - thats 6 million blu-ray players! Of course not everyone is using a ps3 for this purpose, but the increase in blu-ray sales shows that a lot of ps3 owners are taking advantage of this capability.
Mike @ Jul 31st 2007 5:26AM
1st lets correct you statement about PS3
as reported 3 or 4 days ago at ps3fanboy..sony said in it's financial statement they have sold "almost 4.5 million"
http://www.ps3fanboy.com/2007/07/26/playstation-3-hits-4-5-million-sales-worldwide/
Mike @ Jul 31st 2007 5:40AM
I notice you fail to mention how HD DVD had been closing ground in the weeks before that..fact is that week you use no new HD DVD came out that week and it was when the PS3 price was dropped and some places included a free move that may have counted toward blue ray sales.
Lets look at the whole year..and see how well blue ray was doing at the start of year when PS3 owners were bored with their 3 games...but as HD DVD players prices dropped in the spring and summer the weekly sales gaps have been getting smaller.
Day Week YTD SI
01/07 63.3/36.7 63.3/36.7 41.2/58.8
01/14 68.2/31.8 65.7/34.3 43.2/56.8
01/21 67.8/32.2 66.4/33.6 45.1/54.9
01/28 68.8/31.2 67.0/33.0 46.7/53.3
02/04 69.0/31.0 67.4/32.6 48.1/51.9
02/11 69.6/30.4 67.7/32.3 49.3/50.7
02/18 65.0/35.0 67.4/32.6 50.3/49.7
02/25 68.5/31.5 67.4/32.6 51.5/48.5
03/04 65.7/34.3 67.2/32.8 52.2/47.8
03/11 68.7/31.3 67.9/32.1 52.8/47.2
03/18 81.7/18.3 69.2/30.8 54.3/45.7
03/25 n/a 70.4/29.6 55.6/44.4
04/01 n/a 69.9/30.1 56.2/43.8
04/08 62.4/37.6 69.4/30.6 56.4/43.6
04/15 61/39 69/31 57/43
04/22 52/48 68/32 57/43
04/29 71/29 68/32 58/42
05/06 60/40 68/32 57/43
05/13 62/38 68/32 57/43
05/20 58/42 67/33 57/43
05/27 69/31 67/33 58/42
06/03 61/39 67/33 59/41
06/10 66/34 67/33 59/41
06/17 64/36 67/33 59/41
06/24 70/30 67/33 59/41
07/01 65/35 67/33 60/40
07/08 66/34 67/33 60/40
07/15 61/39 67/33 60/40
07/22 74/26 67/33 60/40
Mike @ Jul 31st 2007 5:15AM
Will,
The HD DVD has been $199...last week CC had it on sale for #238.99 and you could use a $40 off coupon to bring it down to $198.99.
As fo the XBOX HD DVD add on.. Aug 1 you can go to CC and get it for $159 with 7 movies.
I have to agree the studios will go to where the money is at, so get the cheap player and wait for the studios wanting your money to follow.
SimbaDogg @ Jul 31st 2007 6:22AM
I dont think i'm gonna post another thing in this topic other than this:
@ eric welch----you're comment about people speculating about the future being equivalent to witch doctor w/ the chicken bones...comedy
Xyzzy @ Jul 31st 2007 8:37AM
@Informed Consumer:
Re: Price
Your graph is extremely misleading. The average cost of a movie isn't higher than Blu-Ray with the exception of the combo disks. The reason the graph on that page shows HD DVD costing more is because of the two Matrix boxsets -- with such a low number of movies available on both sides, adding the two boxsets skews the data.
Fact is, HD DVD is the same price or cheaper than BD. The only exception is the combo disks which are $4 more -- but you get the DVD version of the movie as well, so you get what you pay for.
@Mike: "and it was when the PS3 price was dropped and some places included a free move that may have counted toward blue ray sales."
That's exactly right -- Amazon, for example, gave away Memento (and then when they ran out of that, some other movie but I can't remember which.). Since that was a promotion from Amazon, all of those free movies counted as sales for BD. Considering each of the free movies moved up to the top-10 sales rank (and then quickly plummeted) means that the numbers are definitely going to be skewed since a ton of people bought the PS3 after the drop.
Mike @ Jul 31st 2007 9:04AM
I think it was residence evil...and yes it made the top 10.
I think those buying the movie 300 with the HD DVD add on for to get 7 movies and player for $159 (with $40 CC coupon) is going to have similar effect for theHD DVD sales this week.
reddplague @ Jul 31st 2007 10:01AM
I thinks that we all can agree that this X-mas will be very important for both formats. I get the feeling that fanboys are mostly people who bought their player so, they need to defend their purchase. Those of us who are waiting until for blu-ray profile 1.1 or $150 HD-DVD players are on the fence.
I will buy the player with the most content not for the price since content for last years and this years blockbusters are Blu-ray not HD-DVD FOR NOW!!! I don't care about older movies that are already on DVD I rent all my moives I don't buy.
Since I rent from Blockbuster online I get Blu-ray online and in the store I don't have both choices for HD-DVD.
I will agree that after this X-mas they will been a clear cut winner it will take to long for dual player to reach $150. This war will been done before next X-mas.
This war can't be compared to DVD+-RW because theres only two type of dics to store on the self. Unlike movies which can take alot more shelf space. After this Xmas retailer will start to give more shelf space to which ever player performs better.
leo2178 @ Jul 31st 2007 10:01AM
Easy answer to the HD disk format war.
They will both lose!
Downloadable and on-demand services will kill both of them.
Don't forget most people don't even have HDTV's yet and by the time they do there will be allot more direct content providers.
polly @ Jul 31st 2007 11:01AM
Do you get any of the special features and added content when you use On Demand & other download services?
Iscariote @ Jul 31st 2007 3:11PM
A lot of people like to actually own the movies they buy. Sure HD-DVD and Blu-ray have DRM on the discs, but nothing like the DRM on On Demand services.
reddplague @ Jul 31st 2007 10:26AM
Yeah! thats a good point but, you forget speed and quailty most content sufers quailty for speed and not everbody has a xbox for HD content. It will be a while before those numbers match standalone players.
Don't forget people are still on dail up and those people have DVD players. Maybe in the next ten years online content will start to make a dent in standalone players but for now I'll stick with standalone players.
leo2178 @ Jul 31st 2007 11:31AM
I'm sorry but even while I love 300, I wouldn't go and buy a $200+ player and then a $30+ movie just so I can watch a behind the scenes or making of video that I might watch once. Special features on disks are just there for fanboys. Most consumers never even look at them. I'm not in film school so I don't care what type of camera shots were used.
Both of the formats will be allot like Laser Disk, fanboy and industry loved but not worth it for the avg. consumer.
cedge @ Jul 31st 2007 11:09AM
PS3 have sold 4.5 million, what % of those people are actually watching Blu Ray's or even have a HD TV though?
The Xbox360 is more transparent, if people buy the add on you know that they are going to be watching HD Films.
harryplotter @ Jul 31st 2007 12:54PM
Having a ps3 and no hdtv is like a man with a broken foot and not using crutches to help him walk. Honestly the biggest reason I bought my PS3 was to watch blu-ray movies. I think the majority of PS3 owners use it to watch movies right now because as we all know there aren't any attractive games out for it yet.
I honestly would say that the majority of ps3 owners have hdtv's.
Landlocked @ Jul 31st 2007 12:12PM
Take it for what it's worth -- but someone on another A/V forum posted that Toshiba had 3 HD players in Amazon's to ten DVD players last week.
I don't HD DVD is ready to belly-up yet...I own two of them...but just want a winner either way. I refuse to start a collection until there is one. I own two HD DVD titles and tried renting them (with limited success getting new releases) online. For now, my HD-A1 does one HECK of a job upconverting. My wife often asks me if the disc is HD.
Tom @ Jul 31st 2007 1:06PM
Buying a stand alone player for either format is still a risk right now. Both formats have the potential to lose.
That is why I currently chose Blu-ray in the form of the PS3. At the end of the day, if Blu-ray fails, I can still use it to play games. New games will not cease to exist based on this format war.
With either stand alone player, if/when one of the formats dies, titles will stop coming, and you will be left with a piece of hardware whose only use is to play the remaining titles you have of a dead format.
Sure, right now there are combo players, but once one format has been gone long enough, I suspect they (combo players) would start to disappear too.
So for me, I chose Blu in the form of the PS3. When one format is the definitive winner, then I will buy stand alone players, and not before.
Xyzzy @ Jul 31st 2007 2:03PM
"That is why I currently chose Blu-ray in the form of the PS3. At the end of the day, if Blu-ray fails, I can still use it to play games. New games will not cease to exist based on this format war."
Guess what? At the end of the day my HD DVD player will still upconvert my entire DVD collection, so no big loss there either. I'm never going to re-buy all of the movies I own (I have over 500 of them), and since most accounts are that the standalone HD DVD player is the best upscaling player on the market, it's a no brainer for me and others.
SimbaDogg @ Jul 31st 2007 3:11PM
yeah, too bad the ps3 with its recent update has been reviewed as one of the best upconverting dvd players you can get on the market...